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Topic: Q for JB: Golden-age Human Torch (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post ReplyPost New Topic
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Stan Lomisceau
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Posted: 19 November 2006 at 7:59pm | IP Logged | 1  

you have to admit that maybe if the vision turned white again it would be better than to be torn in half. if the other writer had more ideas like mr byrne instead of the tearing in half marvel would not be doing so bad!
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John Byrne
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Posted: 19 November 2006 at 9:51pm | IP Logged | 2  

We know that the Vision is concious - we can see his thought balloons.

*****

Just as with humans, thought balloons for the Vision merely represent an approximation of what's going on in his brain. A more "realistic" representation would be unreadable, something like 100011101010001000111001100101111100001001010010010000100100 101001001001011100100101010100000110101010001001001000100100 100100010101010001110101000100011100110010111110000100101001 001000010010010100100100101110010010101010000011010101000100 100100010010010010001010101000111010100010001110011001011111 000010010100100100001001001010010010010111001001010101000001 101010100010010010001001001001000101010100011101010001000111 001100101111100001001010010010000100100101001001001011100100 101010100000110101010001001001000100100100100010101010001110 101000100011100110010111110000100101001001000010010010100100 100101110010010101010000011010101000100100100010010010010001 010101000111010100010001110011001011111000010010100100100001 001001010010010010111001001010101000001101010100010010010001 001001001000101010...

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Chris Hutton
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Posted: 19 November 2006 at 10:13pm | IP Logged | 3  

There's a binary joke to be made here somewhere...
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Dave Powell
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Posted: 19 November 2006 at 11:13pm | IP Logged | 4  

As opposed to the normal human brain...

I must.. she's hot.. save the ... oooh that's shiny...what was I thinking?  Oh yeah the world is bein... damn nice butt!... threatened...

Human Torch and Vision are sentient IMO, but not human... because procreation dominates both human sexes.  (Was that too blunt?)


Edited by Dave Powell on 20 November 2006 at 12:01am
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John Benson
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Posted: 19 November 2006 at 11:52pm | IP Logged | 5  


 QUOTE:
010000011010101

I was going to make the joke about the Visions brain being 64 bit but that's got me thinking. Has anyone ever thought through the value of tri-state logic? Having a third, a maybe, in with the positive and negitive? Instead of 010000011010101 it would read 010020200111012021201.

DNA is four bit - ATCG and could be rendered 100203002444404234310 instead of  AACGAGCATGTCAGCACC. It's an information carrying not a logic circuit though 

The basic logics operators for binary are

AND, OR, NAND AND NOR

(A AND B are positive, A OR B is positive, both A AND B are negitive and Neither A OR B is positive)

You'd have AND, OR, NAND, NOR MAND, MOR, MNOR AND MNAND (with M as the maybe)

Any hard core computer scientists out there with an idea if this was possible or even useful?



Edited by John Benson on 19 November 2006 at 11:55pm
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Dave Powell
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Posted: 19 November 2006 at 11:59pm | IP Logged | 6  

Being a medium computer guy... the trinary logic sounded great when Heinlein started forcing it into sci-fi.   But it quickly degenerates into chaos in reality.  Computers need to make a few more jumps before it becomes feasible. The reason it "works" for humans is that it is pushed to the minor role. 

When put into a mathmatical role (say poker)  ..

Hand good.. bet... draw bad... fold

works much better than .. Hand ok... bet.. draw ok... OH CRAP WHAT DO I DO?

I deliberately stayed away from the logic symbols, because logic symbols quickly stack up in a real life situation.
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Joakim Jahlmar
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Posted: 20 November 2006 at 5:03am | IP Logged | 7  

JB wrote:
"Should something that can be so easily copied and retrieved be treated as having the same intrinsic value as a human being? Should any of the human Avengers, for instance, ever risk their lives on behalf of the Vision? My vote would be no (as some of you have probably already guessed) -- but I would say that even if it were not possible to restore or "save" the Vision in any other way. He is a 'toaster'."

Two related follow up questions to this, JB. In comics (especially superhero comics I guess), it is fully possible for people to download their brain patterns into computers, etc. I think it could be argued fairly well that a version of this is what happened to Reed in the Negative Zone during your run on FF. Similarly, the Vision is or was partly structured on the emotional pattern or whatever of Wonderman, which obvisouly indicate that these traits too can be copied, reproduced and saved. Would you say then that it is the non-organic, non-biological and artificial (as in created/constructed rather than born) nature of characters such as the Vision that is the key component to the "toaster" version of things? Or what? How would you treat a someone like Steel in Doom Patrol if say, his brain was destroyed but his brain patterns and memory downloaded and reinstalled in an artificial or positronic brain? Just curious.

JB also wrote:
"Just as with humans, thought balloons for the Vision merely represent an approximation of what's going on in his brain. A more 'realistic' representation would be unreadable, something like 100011101010001000111001100101111100001001010010010000100100 "
[etc, shortened for brevity]

Maybe that is actually how human thoughts look as well, JB. Do we really know?

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Ted Pugliese
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Posted: 20 November 2006 at 9:58am | IP Logged | 8  

Brainiac 5 did such a thing this past Saturday on the Legion cartoon.  He sacrificed himself and just uploaded his saved copy, and ta-daa, he was back to normal, though he would be missing his last day's data.
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