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laszlo takacs Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 September 2006 Posts: 38
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Posted: 30 April 2007 at 12:58pm | IP Logged | 1
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Hey John:
I was surprised to read that you've completed a couple of pages for a
failed Invaders/JSA crossover. Could you post the pages you've
completed?
Also, do you see any possiblity in the future of this project getting
done? I'm not entirely sure why DC and Marvel have stopped doing
crossovers but imagine that JSA/Invaders must be the most anticipated
of them all.
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Michael Andrew Gonoude Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 September 2005 Posts: 2785
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Posted: 30 April 2007 at 2:04pm | IP Logged | 2
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Wha-at?!? JB, have you been holding out on us, your loyal fans (well, okay, sprinkled with a few trolls, but most of us are dead keen on your output, honestly)? Or is there some legal complication barring you from posting these rumored treasures?
Edited by Michael Andrew Gonoude on 30 April 2007 at 2:05pm
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 132135
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Posted: 30 April 2007 at 2:15pm | IP Logged | 3
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Don't know where you heard this, but it is something
less than true.
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laszlo takacs Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 September 2006 Posts: 38
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Posted: 30 April 2007 at 5:38pm | IP Logged | 4
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I apologize if I'm incorrect. I read it on a
particularily exhausting flight so maybe I'm mixed
up. I thought that Invaders/JSA was to be
the sequal to Batman /Captain America and
the first couple of pages were completed. I thought that
there was some bickering between Marvel and DC that ended the project
and it ultimately morphed into Generations.
The Modern Masters book was the source by the way.
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Daniel Kendrick Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 3020
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Posted: 30 April 2007 at 6:24pm | IP Logged | 5
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Just for reference what pages were those?
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laszlo takacs Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 September 2006 Posts: 38
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Posted: 30 April 2007 at 8:14pm | IP Logged | 6
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I actually lost my copy on the plane. It was around
the middle, before the section where John
speaks about his technique and before the "John
Byrne takes on...." chapter.
Maybe I was too fried, but I'm sure I saw something in there about a failed Invaders/JSA project leading to Generations.
Someone help me out.....John?
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Daniel Kendrick Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 3020
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Posted: 30 April 2007 at 11:53pm | IP Logged | 7
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I found the reference. pg 64 of MM: JB.
QUOTE:
ENW: How did the first Generations mini-series get started?
JOHN: It happened because a JSA/Invaders story I wanted to do didn't happen. When I did Batman/Captain America, which was very well received, I said, "Well, now I want to do the sequel," which was the JSA/Invaders. And nobody was interested in doing it at that time. Marvel and DC weren't talking to each other at that point, or something like that. So I said, "How can I do essentially that without having Marvel characters in it?" And I came up with the whole notion of Generations"
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 132135
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Posted: 01 May 2007 at 4:35am | IP Logged | 8
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This would seem, then, to be a rather more innocent example of those times when I say GREEN and fans start buzzing about my having said YELLOW AND BLUE.
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laszlo takacs Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 September 2006 Posts: 38
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Posted: 01 May 2007 at 4:47am | IP Logged | 9
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Sorry, my mistake. I must have combined two seperate stories.
John; could you please answer the second part of my question on the
likelihood of your original Invaders/JSA idea getting published? Why
are DC and Marvel no longer doing crossovers? They've done a ton of
them already so I don't see the problem.
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Daniel Kendrick Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 3020
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Posted: 01 May 2007 at 10:39am | IP Logged | 10
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Iaszlo: Could you have meant Freaks?
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Brandon Carter Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 2338
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Posted: 02 May 2007 at 9:58am | IP Logged | 11
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Iaszlo, here is a link to an article on Newsarama from December 2006 where Dan Didio tells DC's reasons, at least, for not doing more intercompany crossovers.
http://www.newsarama.com/dcnew/Didio/Didio2007Lookahead.html
I've excerpted below the portion of the article dealing specifically with this topic.
NRAMA: One last question - something that always comes up in terms of future plans that neither you nor Marvel has mentioned for years - intercomapny crossovers. Why aren't we seeing those anymore? Yeah - there are the stories of personality differences, and people having to go before there's talk, but still - neither company is in business to lose money. They seem to be a no-brainer, and possibly money left on the table in terms of making something the fans want…
DD: Personally - I'm not a fan of them. We did it. Marvel and DC spent two years doing intercompany crossovers. They crossed over every character. They crossed over universes. They amalgamed the universes. They've done it all. I remember as a fan getting tired of them. Everyone gets excited that they want to see Batman and Daredevil crossover. You know what? We've done it twice already. Why do we need to see another? What's the story going to tell? What's going great for Marvel and DC right now are our ongoing series - people are excited about our monthly books, our continuing fiction. We both have big storylines going on that people are excited about - what's coming up in 52? What's coming up in Civil War? What happens next?
I now interrupt everything for a crossover that involves Superman meeting Spider-Man for the fourth time.
NRAMA: You would almost literally hear the brakes screeching?
DD: Right. Crossovers were a great thing for that moment in time. It was a great trick. But tell you what - after you do JLA/Avengers by Kurt and George, where do you go? How do you one up that? And you have to one up that. No one wants to crossover two characters or two groups and have the immediate reaction, both from the fans, and even from editorial be, "Well, this is good, but it's no JLA/Avengers."
They sound great, they sound fun, but the reality is, you know what? You really want Brian Bendis to write a Batman story, he should write a Batman story. Geoff Johns write Silver Surfer? That's what people really want, I think. They want creators who are working exclusively with one company to work on characters from the other company. That's what they want, in my opinion.
NRAMA: Plus, there's the wanting is better than having aspect…
DD: Of course. I think when people talk about how wonderful those company crossovers were, they're looking back at them with an incredibly wonderful pair of rose-colored glasses. Like I said - I was a fan. I was so excited when Spider-Man met Superman, but I was excited about it because it was the first time they'd met, and also because Ross Andru was drawing Superman. Now - you know what I want to see? I want to see John Romita Jr. draw Batman. I want to see Ethan Van Sciver draw Spider-Woman. That's the excitement now - it's not about the characters meeting, it's about the people who are working on those books. If you've done the story once, you lose the uniqueness, and it all becomes about who's doing the story.
Just to push them because the companies want a crossover is a mistake, I think. Right now, our successes are in our stories and in the characters that inhabit those stories. It's foolish for us to try and stop everything to meet what really amounts to a fan desire. We're spending a lot of time creating our respective fictional realms. To break that flow, to break that momentum to tell a story that really, has already been told. Unless you have the end-all story of the crossovers, I don't see why we need to go there. I think we should be enjoying the characters in the worlds that we've created.
NRAMA: But what about Batman/Spirit?
DD: Different reasons - same company, for one. Batman/Spirit was more along the lines to get people who are Batman fans to sample the Spirit and see that they may like it.
NRAMA: So there's a marketing interest in with the editorial?
DD: Exactly. Everyone's looking for a deep conspiracy theory about why Marvel and DC don't do crossovers anymore, and there really isn't one. They just don't make sense. If Marvel and DC are doing crossovers as a large part of their output and endeavors, then we're both failing, because we're not driving people to our own characters and our own stories. We're just out of ideas.
I don't think that's true for Marvel, and I know it's not true for DC - both cpmpanies are really strong right now. There's no need.
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