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Aleksei Green
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 8:48am | IP Logged | 1
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Another talked about subject from the eighties is the rape of Ms. Marvel. In the avengers Ms. Marvel discovered herself pregnant. She could not understand this as there was no father. Her pregnancy accelerated at an incredible rate and she gave birth to Marcus the son of Immortus. It turned out that Marcus had raped Carol Danvers in his limbo realm and later put his essense inside her womb so that she would give birth to him. It was in affect a rape. A feminist fan has written a piece called THE RAPE OF MS MARVEL. There does appear to be alot of misogyny in this story. Later Chris Claremont dealt with the rape in an Avengers annual. But his story had Carol's mind erased so that was a rape of her mind. What do you fans think of that story? I have purchased the old issues and find the whole pregnancy thing to be very poor. The Brotherhood of Evil Mutants vs. the avengers and the revelations of Carol being raped by Marcus were not much better. Many years later Keith Giffen had the DC character Power Girl impregnated by her then grandfather Arion of Atlantis. Now that was a form of incestuous rape.
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Brad Hague
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 9:09am | IP Logged | 2
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I still have my battered copy of Avenger's Annual #10. Great art by Golden. It was a better story than Avenger's #200 where Ms. Marvel leaves the Avengers to spend time with her lover/son Marcus.
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Bradley Dean
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 9:10am | IP Logged | 3
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It was a terrible story, I mean who runs off with a man they just gave birth to?!?!?!?
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Neil Lindholm
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 9:21am | IP Logged | 4
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I remember reading the comic but don't remember anything about it, other than it had something to do with Rogue as well and the art was good. Could not have been very good if I can't remember anything about it.
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Flavio Sapha
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 9:25am | IP Logged | 5
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Wish I hadn´t stumbled on this thread...
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Aleksei Green
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 9:27am | IP Logged | 6
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Its the issue where a late middle age looking Rogue is supposed to have stolen Carol Danver's powers and memories. Of course years later Rogue was purged of those memories and powers. Rogue seemed to be an oversexed dominatrix type who enjoyed sexually attacking men that she absorbed. She was supposed to be a dumb hick and used expressions like aggregate strength, thats academic to a corpse and other literary expressions. Maybe the mind of Ms. Marvel made her smarter than normal.
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Neil Lindholm
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 9:29am | IP Logged | 7
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Yeah, still does not ring a bell.
Oh, is there a scene of her in a bikini by a pool? The image just jumped into my mind.
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Aleksei Green
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 9:33am | IP Logged | 8
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Neil, I think you are speaking about the issue from 1984 of the Xmen where a scantily clad Rogue was lying on the ground sunning. Then Storm arrived and let Rogue absorb her powers and mind for awhile. Then Gyrich arrived and used the neutralizer on Rogue and Storm.
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Brendan Howard
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 9:36am | IP Logged | 9
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I was an 8-year-old Avengers nut when #200 came out, and I had only just started buying new issues off the newsstand. #198 and #199 were easy to find, but #200 sold out on every newsstand in town before I could get my dad to buy it for me. When I finally did read the story, I was grossed out and a little bit uneasy. I liked Ms Marvel and the whole story didn't sit right with me.
For that reason, I liked the scenes in Avengers Annual #10 where Carol Danvers eviscerated her former teammates for letting her go with Marcus. Claremont can be too wordy and emotional in his writing, but this was a situation where the source story deserved some commentary from the characters within. I never understood why Carol was brought back without powers -- just so Rogue could exist, I guess? Claremont was one of the main writers of Ms Marvel, so he had as much a right to blow up the character as anyone, but still...
Even as a kid, I assumed that Ms Marvel was written off because "Ms" was starting to feel dated as a '70s reference. Then the new Ms Marvel was introduced in The Thing, so I grew even more confused about why Carol Danvers had been knocked down to the 3rd tier and sent to space with the Starjammers.
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Flavio Sapha
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 9:36am | IP Logged | 10
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Never mind.
Edited by Flavio Sapha on 11 September 2007 at 9:36am
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Aleksei Green
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 9:39am | IP Logged | 11
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I certainly never liked the named 'warbird'. It sounded silly to me. And the named Binary was not likeable to me. Its good to have Carol back as Ms. Marvel now.
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Sam Houston
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| Posted: 11 September 2007 at 9:44am | IP Logged | 12
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Another talked about subject from the eighties is the rape of Ms. Marvel. In the avengers Ms. Marvel discovered herself pregnant. She could not understand this as there was no father. Her pregnancy accelerated at an incredible rate and she gave birth to Marcus the son of Immortus. It turned out that Marcus had raped Carol Danvers in his limbo realm and later put his essense inside her womb so that she would give birth to him. It was in affect a rape.
***
First, it's interesting you bring this up when I am currently re-reading my Avenger's collection. I'm on issue #185 (say, when will the Avenger's reading club show these earlier Byrne issues?), so I haven't reviewed #200 yet. As a reminder to us, when Marcus took Carol to limbo was she aware of what was going on (conceding) and then had her memory erased, or was she in a trance while in Limbo, thus not consenting?
And, if she was aware of what she was doing, does her memory being erased of the conception mean she was raped? If so, and going by this frame of thought, then Lois was raped by Superman in the movies.
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Topic Closed)
