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Ed Love
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 05 October 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 2712
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 11:16am | IP Logged | 1
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JB's drawing of Wyatt and the writing of FF in general and Reed in particular always made me think that he'd be perfect with Doc Savage. That era of the FF easily fits what a Doc Savage comic should be.
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Martin Redmond
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Joined: 27 June 2006
Posts: 3882
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 12:07pm | IP Logged | 2
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"What REALLY bugs me about DOFP is the aftermath scene between Sebastian Shaw, Gyrich and Sen. Kelly.
Theydiscuss bringing about a new breed of Sentinel. It seemed to me thatthe Hellfire Club was going to manipulate things and remain on the bookas the X-Men's main nemesis.
And none of it ever went anywhere." They did remain, and it did go somewhere. They used Sentinels against the X-Men the very next story they showed up in and it's the reason the X-Men later get into an uneasy alliance with them. I don't recall every detail, my guess is Shaw was more interested in keeping in charge of the Sentinels than really sending them out on any given mutant? It's even part of JB's first Uncanny story in 281. And I think it's develloped in the first New Mutants story too, though I never read anything before issue 16.
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Steve Adelson
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Joined: 24 May 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 1204
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 12:15pm | IP Logged | 3
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Martin's right about the NM #2 (I had skipped #1, but picked up #2 because of the sentinels cover). It did have Gyrich and Shaw involved. I don't know what "JB's first Uncanny story in 281" means, though...
EDIT: OK, looked up 281, it was from the Jim Lee run... I had forgotten that JB had anything to do with that period.
Edited by Steve Adelson on 06 January 2010 at 1:04pm
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Geoff Gibson
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Joined: 21 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5740
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 12:31pm | IP Logged | 4
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"Days of Future Past" should only have been explored further by you, JB -- perhaps as a miniseries or graphic novel. Based on what we read (not what came after DOFP) how could JB have done any followup -- that world ceased to exist did it not? The X-Men won that one!
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Steve Adelson
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Joined: 24 May 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 1204
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 12:42pm | IP Logged | 5
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Did it? Or did it simply create a new alternate history in which the Sentinels did not take over? JB did something similar at least once before (MTIO #50 / #100), but IMO the stories are less compelling for both the creator and reader if there's nothing really at stake in the "normal" universe.
Having said that, I am still very fond of MTIO #100 particularly.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 12:47pm | IP Logged | 6
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Based on what we read (not what came after DOFP) how could JB have done any followup -- that world ceased to exist did it not? The X-Men won that one!•• Alas, no. In my PLOT they had a clean win, and that future was eradicated. I even managed to convince Mark "Captain Omniverse" Gruenwald that there was no point at which a divergence could occur, since Kate/Kitty was traveling back thru her own life path. The scene that was intended to underscore this was when the X-Men succeed in altering the events that led to that particular future -- the assassination of Senator Kelly -- and Kate simply disappears out of Kitty's head, for all intents and purposes never having been there. Chris, unfortunately, scripted what came to be known as the "lesbian incest" panel, in which Kate leaves Kitty's mind, and essentially hovers in front of her long enough to "impulsively" give her younger self a kiss. Take a look at the picture I drew. See if you can find any trace of that. This was a completely violation of my plot, of course, and opened the floodgates to the seemingly endless crapfest that came after. And, most annoying of all, generated another one where the X-Men lost.
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Flavio Sapha
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: Brazil
Posts: 12912
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 12:49pm | IP Logged | 7
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They used Sentinels against the X-Men the very next story they showedup in and it's the reason the X-Men later get into an uneasy alliancewith them.
++++
I don´t recall the HC using sentinels...they did tussle every now and then, but it tended to revolve more about bad blood between Selene and Rachel Summers.
Next time I recall a Sentinel showing up, it was brought from the future by the Beyonder, in one of his characteristic "pranks".
The uneasy alliance thing was much later, because of the Marauders Mutant Massacre thing.
Ok, that New Mutants stuff I had never seen.
#281 ???
I was long gone by then!
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Keith Thomas
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Joined: 06 April 2009
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 1:32pm | IP Logged | 8
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Yes. And as with just about everything else in that story, I regret it to this day!
This was a completely violation of my plot, of course, and opened the floodgates to the seemingly endless crapfest that came after. And, most annoying of all, generated another one where the X-Men lost.
Wow JB so many of the crappy stories in the X-books stem from stuff you did being warped and twisted. I know you always defer to the X-men's sales rising after you left as leaving Chris above criticism but I have to think a general time lag in sales catching up to a book (stuff like DOFP attracted readers later rather than during that story) and his using familiar elements from your run (give people what they think they want) is a more likely explanation for sales going up not better stories. I didn't get into X-men until around Inferno and had no idea about specific creators or comic history then but I did go back and buy the back issues and remember stopping just before your run ended because X-men @150 - @210 was so bad I couldn't justify buying the more expensive back issues before that, especially if they were this bad (I honestly didn't know much about the Phoenix saga back then).
Though now I really have to wonder what could have been instead of what we got.
I hope some day in some way we get to hear stories.
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Joel Tesch
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Joined: 19 May 2006
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 1:58pm | IP Logged | 9
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"Next time I recall a Sentinel showing up, it was brought from the future by the Beyonder, in one of his characteristic "pranks". " Really? When did this happen...I don't remember that at all. I do remember the future Sentinel Nimrod showing up (and eventually getting into an all-out battle with the X-Men and the Hellfire Club), but that didn't have anything to do with the Beyonder.
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Steve Adelson
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Joined: 24 May 2009
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 2:03pm | IP Logged | 10
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Really? When did this happen...I don't remember that at all.
Uncanny X-Men 202. Part of the massive "Secret Wars II" crossover. It wasn't a prank, exactly, more like the Beyonder being a jerk.
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Joel Tesch
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Joined: 19 May 2006
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 2:09pm | IP Logged | 11
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Oh yeah...when Rachel was out to kill the Beyonder right? I forgot about the Sentinels part!
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John Leach
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Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1860
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| Posted: 06 January 2010 at 2:15pm | IP Logged | 12
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The Sentinels showed up in Uncanny X-Men 151 & 152, under control of the Hellfire Club. I think that was the first time they were used against the X-Men since DOFP.
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