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John Popa
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 March 2008
Posts: 4377
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| Posted: 30 July 2014 at 8:03am | IP Logged | 1
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My take on that is not that Star Wars saved Marvel financially, but it open their eyes to an untapped potential. ----- Sorry, I'm not sure what you mean by this.
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Stephen Robinson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5835
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| Posted: 30 July 2014 at 10:05am | IP Logged | 2
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When discussing the current and future state of the comic
book industry, I think it's important to distinguish
collectors from readers.
Readers have a more casual approach to the product, one
similar to other periodicals they buy. They read and then
later discard their copies of THE ATLANTIC, THE NEW
YORKER, TIME, PEOPLE, US, and so on. Many "readers" also
don't have bookshelves stuffed with titles they have read
or might read. They checked books out of the library or
when they did buy a book, they might loan it to a friend
when done or leave it behind at a hotel.
Collectors are more devoted -- they preserve their comics
boarded and bagged. They "collect" back issues -- not
just to read, not always, but as an acquisition. It was
similar to baseball card collecting.
There is nothing wrong with "collecting." However, when
the industry was the healthiest, the majority of the
purchases came from "readers." Some of the rarest or most
"important" comics from the 1960s or 1970s passed through
hundreds of thousands of hands and were later tossed in
the trash with last month's TV GUIDE or traded for
another book and so on.
The industry made a major shift with the direct market to
a "collector-centric" model. After abandoning newsstands
(or having newsstands abandon them, depending on who you
talk to), comics became a destination purchase, no longer
an impulse buy.
In a way, digital provides an opportunity for publishers
to "return to the newsstand." Granted, the content is
still not what it was during the boom times but the
convenience is key.
I recall a conversation with a comic book store manager
when I asked if he had concerns when Marvel and DC
started offering their back catalog through their
respective apps... and at much lower prices than the same
back issue in a comic book store. The manager said there
was "nothing to worry about" because comic book readers
want the "physical copy." And sure, I could empathize
with wanting the feel and smell of an old comic, but I
thought this missed the larger point that someone might
just want to read the issue and, more importantly, might
appreciate not having to store comics. The latter concept
seemed to blow his mind. And I realized that this guy's
basement or even his living room might look like the
comic book store with long white boxes stuffed with
books. It didn't occur to him that wanting to avoid the
accumulation of books would be a plus.
I took advantage of the Marvel Unlimited 99 cent
promotion this month, and I also subscribed to Kindle
Unlimited. I mention that because as I've gotten older,
the "library" option for my reading material appeals more
and more to me. Yes, there are many books and comics that
I re-read often, but when I look at my collection of
both, I know that's the case for a very small fraction of
them.
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Robert Shepherd
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 March 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 1268
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| Posted: 30 July 2014 at 10:45am | IP Logged | 3
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You bring up good points Stephen. The newsstand model allowed greater access to comics for the younger readers. I know for me, it it were not for the local 7/11, I may not have ever been exposed to comics.
Your conversation with the comic book manager tells me he is in denial...;-) I am a collected/reader, so iI think more like a collector and love to hold what I read. I am also 48 so consider myself old-school when adapting to consumer technology (although an early adapter for business technology...go figure). But even I have come to realize print will not last forever. The whole collector channel will die off in our lifetimes. Will we collectors even care about the industry if there is no potential to sell our comics someday? Maybe not. For me, I care about the art, but most stories I read just not good enough for me to pay hard earned cash.
Who knows, maybe the next generation of collectors will be happy swapping digital files for credits...;-)
Edited by Robert Shepherd on 30 July 2014 at 10:52am
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Stephen Robinson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5835
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| Posted: 30 July 2014 at 11:44am | IP Logged | 4
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ROBERT: The whole collector channel will die off in our
lifetimes. Will we collectors even care about the
industry if there is no potential to sell our comics
someday? Maybe not.
SER: I've also come to the conclusion that my comic book
collection, while priceless to *me* (especially every
book I purchased as a kid), is not worth that much in and
of itself. There's very little cash I could receive for
them. I recall wandering into a comic book store a few
years ago that had a couple copies of INCREDIBLE HULK 340
on sale for, I think, close to $50 an issue. Curious, and
almost half joking, I asked the manager if he'd buy mine
for $10. He said no -- they weren't buying anymore copies
of the book. "So, you won't buy another copy of a book
you're selling for $50? Even just for $10? What about
when you sell these?" He shrugged and said that they
hadn't sold those books for as long as he'd been there.
"Why don't you lower the price?" "That's what they go for
in the Guide," he said. "If we lowered it, we'd lose
money."
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Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 14816
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| Posted: 30 July 2014 at 12:32pm | IP Logged | 5
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Hasn't the collector market died off already, at least with respect to single issues? It seems to me that the collectors have moved on to hardcovers and omnibuses.
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Andrew W. Farago
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 July 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 4067
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| Posted: 30 July 2014 at 1:53pm | IP Logged | 6
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Back issue bins were pretty busy at SDCC this year, but there are fewer dealers every year, and more and more customers are there for bargain shopping. Thanks to sources like eBay and several really bargain-oriented online back issue shops, I'll just about never pay more than half of cover price for anything published since the 2000s, will go one or two bucks each for books dating back to the 1980s, and only expect to pay a premium if I'm going for some cool Bronze or Silver Age comics.
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Joe Hollon
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 13675
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| Posted: 30 July 2014 at 7:20pm | IP Logged | 7
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Chuck decided to return to San Diego next year after all.
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Robert Shepherd
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 March 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 1268
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| Posted: 30 July 2014 at 7:24pm | IP Logged | 8
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Michael: Hasn't the collector market died off already, at least with respect to single issues? It seems to me that the collectors have moved on to hardcovers and omnibuses.
***
I haven't looked but do hardcover or omnibuses increase in price? Seems to me they are always going for cover price.
***
SER:I asked the manager if he'd buy mine for $10. He said no -- they weren't buying anymore copies of the book. "So, you won't buy another copy of a book you're selling for $50? Even just for $10? What about when you sell these?" He shrugged and said that they hadn't sold those books for as long as he'd been there. "Why don't you lower the price?" "That's what they go for in the Guide," he said. "If we lowered it, we'd lose money."
***
LOL...funny story. The guy who said that has no clue. If he isn't turning inventory, he is already losing money and just doesn't know understand why. The space used for that stagnating inventory could have been used to promote a product that he could sell for profit.
And I know I'm stating the obvious here but you only lose money if you resell it for less then the cost of acquisition, regardless of what any guide tells you. It's a mistake to use the guide as gospel.
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Lars Sandmark
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 05 October 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 3144
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| Posted: 30 July 2014 at 7:24pm | IP Logged | 9
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This Mile High fellow complains that he's out thousands of dollars this year in particular because of the corporate-exclusive incentives but if he's saying that is the only reason his profits are down, there's something bigger going wrong for him.
I assume he's blaming this but it can't be the only singular reason, can it?
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Robert Shepherd
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Joined: 30 March 2014
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Posts: 1268
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| Posted: 30 July 2014 at 7:34pm | IP Logged | 10
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I assume he's blaming this but it can't be the only singular reason, can it?
***
You are right. It isn't the only reason. If you read his past articles, they are posted on the MileHigh Website, you'll see he is a very smart business man, so knows exactly where his profits are coming from. I'm sure part of this was a marketing tactic to get folks like us fired up, which in turn, makes it's way into the market, builds steam, and who knows what will happen.
I never really thought MileHigh would not come to SDCC. They'll do what any business would do and look for cost cutting options for next year to make it profitable. Could be reduction in shipping, staffing, less space, or better terms....who knows.
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Shawn Kane
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 November 2010
Location: United States
Posts: 3239
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| Posted: 01 August 2014 at 6:37am | IP Logged | 11
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The last few years my LCS has bought large collections of comics from people and hasn't really had any problem selling most of those individual issues. Avengers #1 and X-Men #1 were both gone within days of one collection being bought. But the store makes back issues a focus as much as new comics and collected editions. They also do a very good job of showcasing those back issues and doing occasional sales that bring people in to find them.
The owner has no concerns about digital affecting his business because the store has a loyal customer base and new people come in all the time (including KIDS!).
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Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 14816
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| Posted: 01 August 2014 at 9:49am | IP Logged | 12
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Michael: Hasn't the collector market died off already, at least with respect to single issues? It seems to me that the collectors have moved on to hardcovers and omnibuses.
***
I haven't looked but do hardcover or omnibuses increase in price? Seems to me they are always going for cover price.
--------
Yep. Out of print books go up in price, often ridiculously so.
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Topic Closed)
