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James Long
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 23 September 2014
Location: Australia
Posts: 60
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 5:36pm | IP Logged | 1
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Why especially a Muslim? They're all demonstrably illogical. _________
That's true. People only take in the parts of religion that appeal to them or repel them . I'd put Plato well above religious clerics because his was a voice that gave the sense of a philosophical voyage. While religions all say it's all magic first and last at at every point in the middle.
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Neil Lindholm
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005
Location: China
Posts: 4940
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 5:40pm | IP Logged | 2
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Why Muslim? The religion demands complete subjugation to Mohammad and his teachings. You must prostrate yourself to him every day and if you decide to leave, you are guilty of apostasy and can be put to death. You have to agree that women are inferior to men and cannot take care of themselves. Finally, after seeing all of the problems in the world caused by Muslim extremists, anyone who would voluntarily join their ilk must have some serous mental and/or emotional issues.
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Josh Goldberg
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 October 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 2065
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 6:40pm | IP Logged | 3
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Sounds like a pretty accurate description of Judaism and Christianity, too. So, why pick on Muslims?
Edited by Josh Goldberg on 28 September 2014 at 6:41pm
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132261
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 6:41pm | IP Logged | 4
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Why Muslim? The religion demands complete subjugation to Mohammad and his teachings. You must prostrate yourself to him every day and if you decide to leave, you are guilty of apostasy and can be put to death. You have to agree that women are inferior to men and cannot take care of themselves. Finally, after seeing all of the problems in the world caused by Muslim extremists, anyone who would voluntarily join their ilk must have some serous mental and/or emotional issues. •• Muslims share at least one thing with every other religion on Earth: problems (acts of terror, murder, cruelty) are caused by "extremists." No, really.
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Kevin Hagerman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 April 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 17995
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 10:41pm | IP Logged | 5
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Neil: Not all Muslims do what some Muslims do. That's why no one calls me a baby-killer just because I look like a fat Timothy McVeigh.
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Neil Lindholm
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005
Location: China
Posts: 4940
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 11:20pm | IP Logged | 6
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The points I made are not extreme points; they are the basic ideas and tenants. If I leave Judaism or Christianity, am I guilty of apostasy? Do I have to declare total subjugation to the cause in Judaism or in Christianity? As well, given a choice as an adult and watching the news, you really think a newcomer to any religion would pick the Muslim faith as the superior one and not have an ulterior motive of holy war? What would attract them to the Muslim faith over another one?
Of course not all Muslims act this way. Most of them are pragmatic and stay Muslim because their family and friends are Muslim or they live in a Muslim-controlled country and they dare not denounce their Muslim faith. It's the new recruits I am talking about. There must be something about the Muslim belief that brings out the worst in people, especially the ones that become Muslim as an adult.
And yes, people will always bring up Timothy McVeigh as the one example. My understanding is that he was against the Federal Government and they way they handled Waco, Texas and Ruby Ridge. Not exactly yelling Allah Akbar while cutting an infidel's head off.
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James Long
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 23 September 2014
Location: Australia
Posts: 60
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| Posted: 29 September 2014 at 12:24am | IP Logged | 7
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What would attract them to the Muslim faith over another one?
___________
I read a statement by one young Caucasian convert to Islam who said something along the lines of;
For a book that has been around for thousands of years (wrong), the Koran is obviously the word of god because Mohammed knew scientific thingies people (meaning her) are only realizing now.
Which does seem to point to a certain kind of naivete but when you look at peoples accounts of their acceptance of other religions there isn't a real lot of difference. Things like 'I was at this crossroads and I let the word of god in because the devil was a'callin' me'
Truthfully if they were to be honest I think most people would say' I was walking past this church type thing and I saw a hot girl going in there so I thought, 'why not, go in there too.'' and then the people inside were really welcoming so the person was too embarrassed to leave.
ALSO you can't say Christianity didn't have it's teething problems. Why, for instance, do you think, that even in so-called christian countries only two of the ten commandments are laws?
Edited by James Long on 29 September 2014 at 10:24am
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Koroush Ghazi
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 October 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 1646
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| Posted: 29 September 2014 at 1:00am | IP Logged | 8
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I'm the last person to defend Islam, given it (like all other religions) is a font of ignorance. Islam ruined my birth country of Iran, so I have little patience for Muslims the world over.
But don't delude yourself into thinking that Islam is worse than other religions. For example, the Koran actually says this about forced conversion: "There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion." It very clearly means that you don't force people to accept Islam.
But just as many modern Christians pick and choose the nice parts of the Bible, and ignore the barbaric, sexist and blatantly wrong parts, in order to make themselves feel good, so too, Muslims frequently do the reverse in order to justify violence and criminal behavior.
Edited by Koroush Ghazi on 29 September 2014 at 1:01am
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Kevin Hagerman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 April 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 17995
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| Posted: 29 September 2014 at 2:47am | IP Logged | 9
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And yes, people will always bring up Timothy McVeigh as the one example. ------ Ya got me! Timothy McVeigh is the only white person who has ever done anything crazy.
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Kevin Hagerman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 April 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 17995
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| Posted: 29 September 2014 at 2:52am | IP Logged | 10
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There must be something about the Muslim belief that brings out the worst in people, especially the ones that become Muslim as an adult. --- It the case of this Oklahoma man, he converted to Islam in prison. Given how piss-poorly we run our prisons in America, you pretty much HAVE to join a gang in prison if you want to survive - this is probably a leading reason for the paucity of atheists in prison (plus there is certainly an impetus to not spend any of the only life you are ever going to have incarcerated).
If you're white, you usually end up in some Aryan piece of shit's harem. If you're black, you usually end up in the Black Muslims.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
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| Posted: 29 September 2014 at 10:15am | IP Logged | 11
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Singling out the Muslim faith as having "something about (it)" that "brings out the worst in people" is like saying Spanish men are lazy, or Irishmen are drunks. It's painting with a ridiculously wide brush, and it's dead wrong.Especially given how much blood has been spilled across the pages of history by folk who were not even remotely Muslim.
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Steve De Young
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 April 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 3488
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| Posted: 29 September 2014 at 10:24am | IP Logged | 12
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Sounds like a pretty accurate description of Judaism and Christianity, too. So, why pick on Muslims?
----------------------------------
This is politically correct nonsense. We can debate about history, but in the present day, there aren't gangs of Jews beheading people in the public square for not keeping the Sabbath. Religious oppression of women by Christians is making them pay for their own birth control. Religious oppression of women by Muslims is forced genital mutilation.
Islam is stuck where other religions were in the Middle Ages (or even earlier in the case of, say, Judaism...). Those followers of Islam who are practicing a more highly evolved version of their faith need to be encouraged to be ever more vocal in denouncing their knuckle draggers so that hopefully their religion can evolve to embrace classical liberal ideals like other religions have.
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