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Eric Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 27 October 2013
Location: United States
Posts: 2292
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| Posted: 02 February 2015 at 12:14am | IP Logged | 1
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DAREDEVIL has a nice rogues gallery too, but they've sort of been retired ever since the Miller years. And possibly for good reason too, since they were mostly doppelgangers of Batman's villains...but GOOD doppelgangers!
THE OWL--THE PENGUIN
THE PURPLE MAN--THE JOKER
THE JESTER--THE JOKER (He gets two!)
MR. FEAR--THE SCARECROW
THE ANI-MEN--THE TERRIBLE TRIO (though it's hard to imagine these minor characters where ever seen by Stan Lee)
Not sure how much of this was intentional (Stan Lee's earliest THOR stories seemed very much like his take on SUPERMAN) and how much was just coincidence. Or perhaps fate. The later (and greatest?) additions to the DAREDEVIL mythos were also functional doppelgangers too...
BULLSEYE--DEADSHOT (two very popular deadeye assassins)
ELEKTRA--CATWOMAN (the love of his life, on the other side of the law)
THE KINGPIN--BOSS THORNE...or FALCONE...or any other crime kingpin in Gotham (the point being that a crime kingpin appeared in both books around the same time)
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Stephen Robinson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5835
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| Posted: 02 February 2015 at 11:25am | IP Logged | 2
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ERIC: f you watch the deleted scenes and listen to the
commentary (yes, there's commentary!) for SUPERMAN 4,
you'll see that there was a whole BIZARRO sub-plot that
was completely edited out! They played him completely
for laughs, but it still brings to mind what might have
been. (If I recall correctly, Nuclear Man is actually
Bizarro's genetic matter remixed!)
There was one episode of the old SUPERBOY show where
Michael J. Pollard appeared in full costume as MR.
MXYZPTLK! That was perfect casting...but he gave a
really lackluster performance. And it was a little weird
seeing a full-grown man dressed in a costume designed
for a 3-foot tall imp!
SER: This reminds me that both Bizarro and Mxyzptlk are
usually played for laughs. I think JB did a good job of
making both characters a serious threat (there was even
a line about people mentally recovering from Mxyzptlk's
shenanigans, which makes sense) but there is still a
tough balance to strike.
You can't make either *too* dark or "grim and gritty."
In other words, Bizarro doesn't really work as a
"Reverse Flash" or "Venom" type character (though, I do
think SMALLVILLE had an interesting spin on him in that
vein). And a Mxyptlk who is depicted like, say, Loki is
still too powerful.
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Brad Monje
Byrne Robotics Member
JBF Microes Master
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 347
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| Posted: 02 February 2015 at 2:11pm | IP Logged | 3
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I haven't read it since it originally was printed, but I think that the comic book adaptation of Superman 4 had the Bizarro story still in it.
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Brian O'Neill
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 13 November 2013
Location: United States
Posts: 1964
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| Posted: 02 February 2015 at 3:42pm | IP Logged | 4
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It didn't. Superman III had already done a 'split personality' subplot, and that was played up even more in the comics adaptation.
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Stephen Robinson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5835
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| Posted: 02 February 2015 at 4:57pm | IP Logged | 5
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BRIAN: It didn't. Superman III had already done a 'split
personality' subplot, and that was played up even more
in the comics adaptation.
SER: Yeah, he's called "Evil" Superman, but the
character's actions are less overtly diabolical and more
in line with a cinematic version of Bizarro (there's
even the twisted version of the classic costume).
Blowing out the Olympic torch and straightening out the
leaning Tower of Pisa are almost classic Bizarro "anti-
logic," and even as performed in the film come across as
nasty adolescent pranks. Even the plot point of the
villain's moll manipulating "Evil" Superman into
disabling the oil tanker would also work with Bizarro.
And like Bizarro, "Evil" Superman isn't really the
"opposite" of Superman. Superman is noble, altruistic,
and brave. "Evil" Superman is simply a jerk but he
spends most of his time getting drunk in a bar. He's not
the outright threat to humanity that you'd think an
*evil* version of a godlike being would be.
Tangentially, I thought the concept of artificial
("red") kryptonite slowing making Superman "evil" would
have worked better with the larger plot of SUPERMAN IV.
Removing all the world's nuclear weapons is a well-
intentioned step in the wrong direction, and it would be
interesting to see Superman slowly become more and more
despotic after this. That's far better than the
ridiculous "literalization" of the nuclear threat known
as Nuclear Man.
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Brad Monje
Byrne Robotics Member
JBF Microes Master
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 347
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| Posted: 02 February 2015 at 8:04pm | IP Logged | 6
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Found it.
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Topic Closed)
