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Topic: CBS sues crowdfunded Star Trek producers (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post ReplyPost New Topic
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Peter Hicks
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Posted: 06 January 2016 at 10:30am | IP Logged | 1  

Now the sarcasm starts. And it's hilarious:

http://wrathofdhanprops.blogspot.com/2016/01/the-axanar-bunk er-when-things-fall-down.html
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Brian Skelley
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Posted: 06 January 2016 at 11:53am | IP Logged | 2  

When I attempted to follow that link, Mr. Hicks, I got a page not found. The hosting page did have a lot of info on it, and why Anaxar was different than the other fan films.

http://wrathofdhanprops.blogspot.com/


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Bill Mimbu
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Posted: 06 January 2016 at 8:49pm | IP Logged | 3  

Rather disappointed to hear about this, since I did like the Prelude short film.

I visited the Axanar Booth at WonderCon 2015, and had a chat with Alex Peters.

They were definitely looking for volunteers to do technical design and drafting, and while I wasn't about throw my hat into the ring, I did have a bit of a nagging in the back of my mind that I passed on an opportunity...

How things change almost a year later...
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Marten van Wier
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Posted: 06 January 2016 at 9:17pm | IP Logged | 4  

Thank you for the link Brian Skelley. I still don't know if this is the full picture but at least I now have a better idea on what is going on.

It seems I was rather hasty with jumping on the defence of Axanar.
Still I am a little hesitant these days on the issue of fan creations versus professional products as producers or IP owners these days also want a certain percentage when money is involved in a fan product or if money can be made off of it.

It sometimes becomes unclear to me then if a company is simply protecting its property rights when someone is using said property to crowdfund a project based on it.
Or when someone is making a commercial product, complete with salaries for the project members, without getting permission or buying one from the owners first.

It is likely that this project will be forced to shut down.
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Brian Skelley
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Posted: 14 March 2016 at 11:59am | IP Logged | 5  

In this strange case (which should really be cut and dry) it appears that the makers of this fan film have pushed back on Paramount. They had insisted Paramount explain on how exactly their film stepped on Paramount's IP. Paramount has put out a list of what they've already seen, including the use of the Klingon language. I'm baffled and more than slightly amused by the defense of this film. Oddly enough they keep digging themselves in their own holes by doing interviews. At one point they claimed that Paramount couldn't shut them down because they didn't have a finished script (which I'm not sure what that has to do with it. They were "selling" coffee with the Star Trek logo on it to fund things) even though they had posted on Facebook a while back they had the finished "locked" script. 

More info here..
link
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Conrad Teves
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Posted: 16 March 2016 at 6:51pm | IP Logged | 6  

An interesting twist--Justin Lin comes out as Team Axanar:   http://www.inquisitr.com/2892447/star-trek-beyond-director-j ustin-lin-fan-film-klingon-language-copyright-infringement/


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Tim O'Neill
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Posted: 16 March 2016 at 11:23pm | IP Logged | 7  



After the announcement of extensive reshoots, Justin Lin needs all the friends he can get.

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Paul Greer
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Posted: 17 March 2016 at 7:09am | IP Logged | 8  

Ha!
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Peter Hicks
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Posted: 17 March 2016 at 1:06pm | IP Logged | 9  

Apparently the climax with Vin Diesel and The Rock racing starships was not well received.
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Brian Skelley
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Posted: 20 April 2016 at 12:26am | IP Logged | 10  

In a very odd way of going about 'defending' their movie they're making, the makers of Axanar are claiming that Paramount can't copy write the Klingon language, which is one of the points that Paramount is claiming the Axanar makers are unjustly using. Are there really people out there in real life (I know it's a ongoing trope to show how geeky a character is by having them speak Klingon) that speak Klingon to the point that it could be considered a real language?

Link
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Bill Mimbu
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Posted: 23 April 2016 at 7:21pm | IP Logged | 11  

I remember this from the FREAKAZOID cartoon show:

Cave Guy: "Oh dear, a Klingon-to-English dictionary. You, made up a little language based off a TV show. That's not right!"
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John Byrne
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Posted: 23 April 2016 at 7:47pm | IP Logged | 12  

I sometimes worry about Trekkies who are teaching their children Klingon as a second language.

You know they're out there!

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Bill Mimbu
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Posted: 26 April 2016 at 7:36am | IP Logged | 13  

And CBS has given a legal "heads-up" to another fan production not to go ahead with a sequel, because of the Axanar lawsuit:

Trek Movie Link

At least the HORIZON production got a personal communication, not just a cease and desist.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 26 April 2016 at 8:14am | IP Logged | 14  

And CBS has given a legal "heads-up" to another fan production not to go ahead with a sequel…

••

Old point of law at work there, I expect. Once is parody (or, I suppose, "homage"), twice is infringement.

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Brian Skelley
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Posted: 27 April 2016 at 1:39pm | IP Logged | 15  

It appears that on May 9th this goes in front of a court. One thing I'm completely confused about and hope someone can help me understand, is the fair use stuff. According to this article that just came out, LINK the people making Axanar are saying that they haven't violated any copyrights and the stuff they used, such as Vulcan ears are under fair use. I'm struggling to see how anyone could make a project based so much on an existing IP that without violating a copyright. I had thought fair use was more of a you're able to use it when talking about it, or when making a parody. Taking in kickstarter and another fundraising campaign via indiegogo to make a feature film seems like it couldn't possibly be covered under fair use... am I totally off base here? These guys have brought in over $1.3 million dollars and are supposed to be using it to make a complete feature film that's a story in the Star Trek universe, complete with it's races. How is that possible to do without violating any of the copyrights? Is there really a chance these people could somehow win this case? Even the argument that its' not completed shouldn't hold much water as you either make the movie and violate the copyrights or you've committed fraud and gotten money out of all those people for something that will never be made. That's not even getting into the "perks" for donating that have not only been made and shipped to their donors, they had at one point reportedly been selling them in their own store.

I get these people are trying to paint themselves the victims of the evil corporations and all they want to do is make a movie that fans will love. Even then, you'd still have to know what you're doing is violating what Paramount/CBS own.

The other interesting part is how Paramount/CBS are now telling other fan films to shut down so they can't be used against them in the case. The split among the fans of this stuff is really interesting to me. I've never seen Trek people so split like this before. The closest is when they announced the Next Generation... though even more so as this we now have the internet and I'm not just hearing the people coming through the comic shop I lovingly worked at in my youth.
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Conrad Teves
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Posted: 21 May 2016 at 7:14am | IP Logged | 16  

Well!  Lawsuit dropped!
So has CBS come to their senses, or lost their mind?

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John Byrne
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Posted: 21 May 2016 at 7:22am | IP Logged | 17  

So has CBS come to their senses, or lost their mind?

••

I'd say the latter, as they will realize when a tsunami of similar projects comes washing over them.

I'm reminded of when I testified on Marvel's side in a lawsuit against them. The guy suing had said he could not understand why Marvel had chosen to fight his suit rather than just throwing some money at him to make him go away. At the time, I thought he must have had very bad legal advice if he thought that was likely to happen. If Marvel had simply "settled" they would have had a swarm of creators clawing at their corporate purse -- and, hell! I would have been one of them!

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Brian Skelley
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Posted: 22 May 2016 at 12:25pm | IP Logged | 18  

 Conrad Teves wrote:
Well!  Lawsuit dropped!


Not dropped but the parties involved have entered settlement talks. Everyone's expecting the it to be settled out of court, with Paramount/CBS getting paid something from it. They're also expecting a set of rules on what you can and can't do with fan versions of the IP. I'm sure those rules won't be so loved.

The most odd thing is the director of the new film and JJ Abrams have both publicly slammed Paramount for protecting it's IP. You'd think as they make a living making movies they'd be more interested in seeing IP protected.. I guess you can't be a hero if you side with the man.
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Conrad Teves
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Posted: 23 May 2016 at 9:22am | IP Logged | 19  

According to this, dropped:

While Paramount/CBS is obviously well within their rights to protect their IP, I think a real danger for them in how they do this (in terms of *damaging* their IP)  is clearly and distinctly reminding the fans that their carefully crafted universe and playground for the imagination isn't that at all, it's just IP.  They're just trying to sell you something.

Other industries try to get you to latch on to their products as having significance beyond what the thing actually is.  Fiction has immersion and investment in stories and characters to do this.  It's an illusory bubble I wouldn't think you'd want to casually pop.
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Michael Casselman
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Posted: 23 June 2016 at 8:58am | IP Logged | 20  

http://www.startrek.com/fan-films

New guidelines released for fan productions.

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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 23 June 2016 at 9:39am | IP Logged | 21  

Well, I'd say those guidelines should effectively put an end to the majority of the fan productions currently in operation.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 23 June 2016 at 9:44am | IP Logged | 22  

Those guidelines all seem perfectly reasonable to me.
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 23 June 2016 at 10:06am | IP Logged | 23  

Reasonable, yes. But, when several of the better-known fan-series have "STAR TREK" in their titles, run for 40-50 minutes per episode, and exist specifically to recreate characters/sets/props/costumes from the real shows...well, there's gotta be some major retooling in store, if those productions are gonna survive.

PHASE II and CONTINUES, in particular (the only ones I have regularly checked out, since their whole point is to meticulously recreate the look and feel of TOS and produce "new" episode of that show) will be completely sunk by these guidelines. Not to say that CBS/Paramount aren't within their rights to impose these restrictions and protect their property, of course.

Still, you never do know. Creativity thrives on restrictions, and maybe we'll see some clever fan-made stuff come out of this.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 23 June 2016 at 10:31am | IP Logged | 24  

Intellectual property rights are delicate as a dragonfly wing, and must be zealously protected. We've seen what happens when they're not.

Like I said, I really can't see anything wrong with these guidelines.

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David Miller
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Posted: 23 June 2016 at 12:54pm | IP Logged | 25  

No fraudulent content?!?!? FASCISM!

The language almost makes it sound like Paramount could stop fans from making more than 30 minutes of content total with any given character. If a fan character appears in a separate story, is that considered a sequel, additional part or additional episode? 

All participants must be unpaid. Are they allowed to pay to rent equipment or studio space? Is the $50k capped budget just allowed to be used to purchase official licensed merchandise? 

Not being allowed to copyright the work would be my deal-breaker, if I were the kind of person who produced fan fiction. 
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