Active Topics | Member List | Search | Help | Register | Login
The John Byrne Forum
Byrne Robotics > The John Byrne Forum << Prev Page of 4 Next >>
Topic: Is It The Story Or How Long It Takes To Tell It? (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post ReplyPost New Topic
Author
Message
Mario Ribeiro
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: June 18 2016
Location: Brazil
Posts: 474
Posted: February 25 2017 at 10:02pm | IP Logged | 1  

I think that, even more than being young, what matters is to be new. It seems that the easiest way to write about heroes is through that damn hero journey. It's not enough to beat the villain, you have to prove you're worthy.

That said, readers take whatever is thrown at them. So, my Flash is Wally, because he was the one being published when I was collecting, and Barry was just a memory, often used in those "return" stories that didn't pay off. I like Wally.

So, if you're a kid today and you enjoy Jane Thor, good for you. It's not a story, it's a run, in which I'm sure she encounters a number of menaces. It should be important to some readers. I'm not defending something I don't read, but I won't attack it either. I know that some Silver Age fans despised the stuff that rocked my world back in the eighties.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Mike Norris
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: April 16 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4274
Posted: February 25 2017 at 10:08pm | IP Logged | 2  

It's weird to read Marvel comics full of alternate Earths and legacy heroes. 
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
Brian Floyd
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: July 07 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 8360
Posted: February 26 2017 at 2:03am | IP Logged | 3  

Jane Foster as Thor is nothing more than rehashing an old issue of What If? and running it into the ground.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Happens to be one of my favorite issues of What If?, in fact.

I didn't mind the idea of a female character becoming a new version of Thor, but I hated the execution of it. Making it Jane Foster was the obvious choice AND easy way out. Not thrilled that the real Thor lost an arm, either.

But M****l has gone way overboard with legacy heroes. And I'm not happy with the way that them and DC both have gone about it, in certain cases. I know they're trying to get more ethnic diversity, but replacing a perfectly good existing character (and in DC's case, doing it by killing off the existing characters, Blue Beetle and Firestorm) doesn't work for me. I especially think it was a bad idea to give us not one, but TWO, new Iron Men: Victor Von Doom and a teenage girl. Doom as a hero *might* work (if you forget he's the very definition of an arrogant egomaniac), I suppose....NOT!

Oh, and the previous wave of Marvel's legacy heroes, I hated that they killed off Eric Masterson rather than just depowering him, yet left USAgent (who I like to refer to as `Asshole America') alive.

(Of the current crop of legacy heroes, I'll be surprised if any of them are still around in any capacity in five years, other than Miles Morales and X-23. Doom doesn't count, for obvious reasons, and will likely be back to being Doctor Doom well before then.)




Edited by Brian Floyd on February 26 2017 at 2:09am
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
Eric Sofer
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: January 31 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 4789
Posted: February 26 2017 at 9:56am | IP Logged | 4  

What the actual fuck.

If comics are at a point where someone has to say, "Who's Superman/Captain America/Wonder Woman/Batman THIS month?" then they're dead. It is now about a name and costume, not a character and story. Hire some twelve year olds to write words and some artists to draw a book full of pinups.

Do I see any exceptions? Maybe. Green Lantern became very obviously a rank, not an individual hero. But Earth's Green Lantern was Hal Jordan... and while it was interesting having a couple others, WHY WOULD EARTH NEED MORE THAN ONE GREEN LANTERN?

There is no question that there are other Kryptonians, Asgardians, Amazons, heralds, Atlanteans, etc. and if they have interesting stories, great! But don't replace the original heroes... that's what started people reading the books in the first place.

Ah, forget it. I'm of no interest to the comic companies any more. Somebody just shoot me and dump me in the corner, and let those hundreds of comic readers have their way for another couple years. I doubt it'll last much longer than that.
Back to Top profile | search
 
John Byrne
Avatar
Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: May 11 2005
Posts: 132311
Posted: February 26 2017 at 10:05am | IP Logged | 5  

If comics are at a point where someone has to say, "Who's Superman/Captain America/Wonder Woman/Batman THIS month?" then they're dead. It is now about a name and costume, not a character and story. Hire some twelve year olds to write words and some artists to draw a book full of pinups.

•••

From where I sit, that started to happen a long time ago. I recall Terry Austin noting that Todd McFarlane, working onnSpider-Man books, had come up with a way to produce monthly portfolios.

Back to Top profile | search
 
Eric Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: October 27 2013
Location: United States
Posts: 2292
Posted: February 26 2017 at 10:19am | IP Logged | 6  

"Also keep in mind, once these multi-year status quo changing storyline end, they don't go back to the original status quo anymore. The characters never go back to center."

Yeah.  Ed Brubaker writing CAPTAIN AMERICA as a super-espionage title for a number of years was one of my favorite newer runs, but then they killed him off for three years and replaced him with Bucky/Winter Soldier.  I knew they would bring him back eventually, so I stuck with it even though the Bucky/Cap issues were somewhat boring.  They finally brought Steve Rogers back from the dead--in a storyline that's still confusing to me.  For a while, we had Steve back as Cap, but Brubaker's heart wasn't in those issues and he finally left.

Then we got Cap stuck in Dimension Z as basically a sci fi title for a year.  (Totally the wrong approach for Cap!)

Then he came back but was immediately "de-supered" and aged into an old man for a couple of years.  Sam Wilson (who as the Falcon was very popular in the movies) was the new Cap.  (Didn't we just do this with Bucky five years earlier?)

Then we had Marvel's version of "Crisis on Infinite Earths" and all the books were weird alternate reality versions and Cap's "son" Ian from Dimension Z was the star of the book--which was "Hail Hydra" for a few months.  (Which I had to suffer through since I---foolishly--had a subscription and that's what they chose to send me as a replacement series.)

Finally, it was advertised that Steve Rogers was going to return as (a young) Captain America again--but with a different shield and an ugly costume.  Okay, but at least it would be the REAL Cap again, so I was on board...and then they retroactively made him a murderous, traitorous Hydra agent.

So, Captain America is my favorite super-hero and I would love to be buying his book--and I'm sure at least a few of his new millions of fans from the movies would too!

But we haven't had a good, regular Steve Rogers/Captain America comic since his "death"--and that was 2007!  Ten years!  How does any of this make sense?!?  How does that satisfy anybody looking for the real Cap?  Just from a marketing point of view--how does that strengthen the franchise?  Just from a totally selfish, cynical, greedy point of view, how does any of that sell toys or merchandise?  What a waste of three movies (not to mention the AVENGERS movies) that could have served as $100 million commercials for the comic!

If they were actively trying to drive away old fans like me AND potential new readers (from the movies and the present high public profile), they could not do a better job of it!


Edited by Eric Jansen on February 26 2017 at 10:21am
Back to Top profile | search
 
Mike Norris
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: April 16 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4274
Posted: February 26 2017 at 12:24pm | IP Logged | 7  

 Eric Sofer wrote:
](and in DC's case, doing it by killing off the existing characters, Blue Beetle and Firestorm)

DC has reversed both of those. Ronnie and Stein are back to being Firestorm with Jason serving in a support role. Ted Kord is now serving as a mentor for Jamie's Blue Beetle,  Ted likes wearing goggles and blue t-shirts with a beetle design. 

 Eric Jansen wrote:
Do I see any exceptions? Maybe. Green Lantern became very obviously a rank, not an individual hero. But Earth's Green Lantern was Hal Jordan... and while it was interesting having a couple others, WHY WOULD EARTH NEED MORE THAN ONE GREEN LANTERN?

 In case the regular one slips in the shower. 

And of course a GL's beat is more than one planet, its one of 3600 sectors of the Universe. So a better question is why each sector doesn't have more Green Lanterns? 
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
Brian Floyd
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: July 07 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 8360
Posted: February 26 2017 at 1:42pm | IP Logged | 8  

I mostly agree with Eric's post, considering Steve Rogers, not whichever character is wearing the Captain America suit, is my favorite Marvel hero. 

While I was against making Bucky the new Captain America, the run was okay for me. But I hate everything they've done with Steve since Brubaker left.

The HYDRA garbage I know will eventually be undone, but the new costume and shield suck. I especially don't like Cap without the wings on the head, and gloves and boots design are awful. The shield looks like something Battlestar should carry if they ever bring him back. And, again, why does he need a belt with pouches? He's not Batman.

Good to know Ronnie, Stein and Kord are back. 

Funny thing about the Green Lanterns is, while I have no clue about the two running around in the Justice League and their own series, Hal is my least favorite of Earth's GLs currently running around that I know about! (My favorite is the original, Alan Scott, but if we're talking GL Corps, then its John Stewart.)
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
John Byrne
Avatar
Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: May 11 2005
Posts: 132311
Posted: February 26 2017 at 2:09pm | IP Logged | 9  

...why does [Captain America] need a belt with pouches? He's not Batman.

•••

But he IS a soldier. Of all the changes that have been inflicted on Cap's uniform in recent years, the "utility belt" is the only one that makes sense to me.

Back to Top profile | search
 
Mike Norris
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: April 16 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4274
Posted: February 26 2017 at 3:14pm | IP Logged | 10  

I'd still what to know what's in those pouches. What do soldiers carry in their's? From what I tell its ammo..  Cap doesn't carry a gun, so he doesn't need ammo cartridges. 
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
Wallace Sellars
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: May 01 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 17671
Posted: February 26 2017 at 5:43pm | IP Logged | 11  

WHY WOULD EARTH NEED MORE THAN ONE GREEN LANTERN?



This came up during a conversation I was having with a coworker. As much as I
like the JLAnimated John Stewart, it doesn't change my opinion that there
should only be one Green Lantern per sector.
Back to Top profile | search | www
 
Richard Stevens
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: May 04 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1929
Posted: February 26 2017 at 7:50pm | IP Logged | 12  

If you're going to have two Green Lanterns on Earth, make it for some kind of extraordinary reason. Like, maybe there's two because Earth is the home of the last Kryptonian and the Guardians have old grudges.
Back to Top profile | search | www
 

<< Prev Page of 4 Next >>
  Post ReplyPost New Topic
Printable version Printable version

Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot create polls in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

 Active Topics | Member List | Search | Help | Register | Login