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Neil Lindholm Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: China Posts: 4939
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 6:12pm | IP Logged | 1
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Username wrote:
Lewinsky wasn't a student it's not a fair comparison. |
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She was an intern which makes her a student. It is never consensual when someone who has the power to ruin your career chooses to make advances on their subordinate. One word from Clinton and her career would have been over.
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Anthony J Lombardi Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: United States Posts: 9410
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 6:33pm | IP Logged | 2
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It is never consensual when someone who has the power to ruin your career chooses to make advances on their subordinate. One word from Clinton and her career would have been over. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I don't dispute that sometimes that happens. But unless is there evidence that Clinton is guilty of doing that. You can not say for certain that he did that. And you can not say that it wasn't consensual. It is possible that he simply made a sexual advance towards her. It is also possible that had she rejected him nothing would have come of it.
I also repeat that maybe you are correct. Maybe Clinton is guilty of doing what you suggest. If he did than he is guilty.
But it is equal possible that the events could have happened differently. Or it could have been any combination of everything we wrote. Without proof of how it went. We must be open to all possibilities.
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Neil Lindholm Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: China Posts: 4939
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 6:38pm | IP Logged | 3
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Doesn't matter. Even if I made an advance on one of my legal-aged students, and even if she consented, it is still wrong. There is no situation where it is not inappropriate. There can't be. If she attempted to seduce him, his correct response would have been to refuse her advances and found a way to diffuse the situation. I know of at least two teachers who went to the Principal to let him know about a student (a legal-aged one, not that it matters) who was propositioning them. It was dealt with. That is the proper response. Still amazed how Clinton got a pass on this one and how everyone attacked Lewinsky instead.
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Neil Lindholm Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: China Posts: 4939
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 6:39pm | IP Logged | 4
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When I was in the Army, it was against the rules to be in a relationship with someone under your authority. Just common sense.
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David Miller Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Posts: 2997
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 6:54pm | IP Logged | 5
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Clinon and Lewinsky's relationship was entirely inappropriate and unprofessional. And according to both parties, who were both adults, it was entirely consensual. It was only "molestation" in the right's twisted moral order, which often can't distinguish bestiality from masturbation and suggests "legitimate" rape victims should seek forgiveness.
And it's ridiculous to pretend the right actually cares. Ted Nugent became legal guardian, then married, a 17 year old, which is the kind of thing Bond villains do, and he visited the White House yesterday.
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Anthony J Lombardi Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: United States Posts: 9410
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 6:55pm | IP Logged | 6
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When I was in the Army, it was against the rules to be in a relationship with someone under your authority. Just common sense. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~` I can certainly agree with you about it being common sense.
Regardless of how it went down between Clinton and Lewinsky. It was a bad judgement call for both parties involved. Especially so for Clinton because of his position.
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Neil Lindholm Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: China Posts: 4939
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 7:52pm | IP Logged | 7
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QUOTE:
And according to both parties, who were both adults, it was entirely consensual. |
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It can never be consensual when there is a power imbalance.
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Neil Lindholm Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: China Posts: 4939
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 7:54pm | IP Logged | 8
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QUOTE:
Ted Nugent became legal guardian, then married, a 17 year old, which is the kind of thing Bond villains do, and he visited the White House yesterday. |
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Nugent in the White House. Never thought I would see that.
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Jim Lynch Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 August 2006 Location: United States Posts: 617
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 8:08pm | IP Logged | 9
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you know, I don't post a whole lot around here, basically because I don't want to look stupid with so many learned folks here. But what the FUCK is it about Bill Clinton that makes conservatives so unglued? Trump couldn't bring ol Slick up enough during the campaign, now in a discussion about Bill O'Reilly being fired for serially victimizing women, we have to drag Clinton up again? I in no way defend Clinton's actions vis a vis Ms. Lewinsky, but the situations are not the same. but for God's sake, let's continue to bring up the actions of a man who left the White House sixteen goddamn years ago. Let's dredge up LBJ, or Warren Harding while we're at it
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Anthony J Lombardi Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: United States Posts: 9410
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 8:10pm | IP Logged | 10
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And according to both parties, who were both adults, it was entirely consensual. |
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It can never be consensual when there is a power imbalance. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I can't help but disagree with your use of the word never Neil. I've seen several work place affairs where superiors were involved with people directly under them. I know for a fact that it was consensual. One of them eventually led to marriage. The other ended up being casual sex. At no point before during or after did the superior abuse their power.
Oh I would also add that in both those cases the superior was a woman. Also in both cases they were the one to instigate the affair.
In the case of the one concerning the casual sex. The three of us were very close to each other and I was privy to what was going on from both sides.
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Neil Lindholm Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: China Posts: 4939
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 8:22pm | IP Logged | 11
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Teapot Dome. Disgraceful. Bloody Republicans.
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Neil Lindholm Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: China Posts: 4939
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Posted: 20 April 2017 at 8:24pm | IP Logged | 12
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Talking as a foreigner, my understanding on why Republicans get angry when Clinton is mentioned is the perceived pass he got from the media. If I remember at the time, he was their fair-haired child and Lewinsky was the villain and the press ran with that story, that he was the victim and she was the evil manipulator and temptress.
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