Active Topics | Member List | Search | Help | Register | Login
The John Byrne Forum
Byrne Robotics > The John Byrne Forum Page of 2 Next >>
Topic: The Body Shaming of Amanda Waller Post ReplyPost New Topic
Author
Message
John Byrne
Avatar
Beam Me Up, Scotty!

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 108739
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 8:38am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

As most of you know, I was first to draw this character, and the model was very simple: Nell Carter.

Since I let loose of her, tho, Amanda's odyssey has been pretty shameful. She translated more or less whole into animated versions, but it didn't last. Artists and Hollywood casting directors immediately slimmed her down. And, in the case of the drawn versions, without a whisper of a suggestion that she actually look like the same woman minus some pounds.

Back to Top profile | search
 
Robbie Parry
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 17 June 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 8429
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 9:06am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

I had wondered about the change. 

Are there woman of the same size elsewhere in comics?
Back to Top profile | search
 
Andrew Bitner
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 01 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5112
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 9:26am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Her New52 incarnation was ridiculous, looking like she was based on Angela Bassett.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Eric Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 27 October 2013
Location: United States
Posts: 995
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 9:53am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

It's hard to complain too much about good, cool, name African-American actresses like Angela Bassett, Viola Davis, or Pam Grier being cast as Waller--at least they were mostly the appropriate age and of realistic physique, but when ARROW cast a super-skinny unknown as the character, it was especially ridiculous--and annoying when I remembered she was nicknamed "The Wall" because she was large!
Back to Top profile | search
 
Mario Ribeiro
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 18 June 2016
Location: Brazil
Posts: 227
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 11:53am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

And, since the world is ridiculous, some claim that the real Wall fit the "Mammy" stereotype, so they see the "babe" version as an improvement.
Back to Top profile | search
 
John Byrne
Avatar
Beam Me Up, Scotty!

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 108739
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 12:02pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

… some claim that the real Wall fit the "Mammy" stereotype…

••

Demonstating once again that these idiots have no idea what they're talking about.

Back to Top profile | search
 
John Byrne
Avatar
Beam Me Up, Scotty!

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 108739
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 12:03pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

It's hard to complain too much about good, cool, name African-American actresses like Angela Bassett, Viola Davis, or Pam Grier being cast as Waller...

••

That swings awful close to racism. "It's all cool as long as she'd Black."

Back to Top profile | search
 
Andrew Bitner
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 01 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5112
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 12:29pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

They're all good actresses. Not one is right for Amanda Waller, as created on the comic book page. Not that that stops Hollywood. It's just more evidence of their inability to think beyond a highly attractive face.
Back to Top profile | search
 
James Johnson
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 16 March 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 610
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 12:40pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

I know this may sound like l see the world in rose-colored glasses......

But people come in all shapes, sizes, and colors. I did not have a problem with Amanda Waller being a large woman. I saw her being a strong female and a role model.

Hollywood and many folks who work in the comic book industry VERY rarely model their cast on what the real world looks like.


Back to Top profile | search
 
Matt Hawes
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 13810
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 12:48pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

Unless it's for comedic purposes, it seems that in the entertainment industry only pretty people are allowed to exist.

I recall thinking, even as a teen, how refreshing it was to read THE NEW MUTANTS by Chris Claremont and Bob McLeod because McLeod had designed characters that looked like real teens. Sam Guthrie was tall,  lanky, had big ears and was even a tad goofy-looking in a real sort of way. Rahne Sinclair looked like a kid, and was not a stereotypical sexpot. 

After Rob Liefeld and later artists got ahold of the characters,  that all changed. They became cookie-cutter sexy superheroes. Blech.

JB's characters also get this a lot. Kitty Pryde, Wonder Girl (Cassie), Waller, and more. Even Puck in a sense, since God forbid there be an actual little person as a superhero. Somehow, It was thought better having him once had been shown as a normal sized person cursed with a demon to become a dwarf ( or whatever that nonsense explanation was).


Back to Top profile | search | www
 
Vinny Valenti
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6216
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 1:13pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

"Rahne Sinclair looked like a kid, and was not a stereotypical sexpot."

--

Maisie Williams is spot-on casting for Wolfsbane in a NEW MUTANTS movie. Too bad pretty much nothing else is looking to be done right.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Matt Hawes
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 13810
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 4:40pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Vinny, I agree about Maisie Williams being cast, and pretty much the rest of your statement. 
Back to Top profile | search | www
 
Bill Collins
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 26 May 2005
Location: England
Posts: 9053
Posted: 09 November 2017 at 11:13pm | IP Logged | 13 post reply

Patricia Belcher struck me as an apt actress for Waller.
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
John Byrne
Avatar
Beam Me Up, Scotty!

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 108739
Posted: 10 November 2017 at 7:42am | IP Logged | 14 post reply

I did not have a problem with Amanda Waller being a large woman.

••

She was WIDE, not LARGE! :)

Back to Top profile | search
 
Marc Baptiste
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 17 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 2782
Posted: 10 November 2017 at 10:40am | IP Logged | 15 post reply

Not only did I have no problem with Amanda Waller being a WIDE woman, in fact, she ONLY works for me when she is portrayed as being a WIDE woman!

Marc
Back to Top profile | search
 
John Byrne
Avatar
Beam Me Up, Scotty!

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 108739
Posted: 10 November 2017 at 3:04pm | IP Logged | 16 post reply

Maisie Williams is spot-on casting for Wolfsbane in a NEW MUTANTS movie.

•••

Just spent a few painful minutes googling Rahne, and I have to say it looks as if, at this point, a sack of hammers would be "spot-on-casting". That child has been put through some changes!!

Back to Top profile | search
 
Shane Matlock
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 12 August 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 1026
Posted: 10 November 2017 at 3:46pm | IP Logged | 17 post reply

Her nickname doesn't really work when she's rail thin, does it? So many writers just don't get it. And comics needs more body types than just the sexy ones. I think you've done a great job with that, JB, with characters like Amanda Waller and Big Bertha and Pink Pearl. As well as on the opposite end of body types with Wonder Girl from your Wonder Woman run, which the DC writers eventually turned into just another sexy heroine sadly. 
Back to Top profile | search
 
Jabari Lamar
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 18 October 2017
Location: United States
Posts: 12
Posted: 10 November 2017 at 4:50pm | IP Logged | 18 post reply

It's a darn shame CCH Pounder, who voiced Amanda Waller in cartoons, never got a chance to play her in live action. I thought she looked pretty close to the original comic-book version. And I loved her THE SHIELD.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Adam Schulman
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 22 July 2017
Posts: 230
Posted: 10 November 2017 at 5:15pm | IP Logged | 19 post reply

In the comics Amanda is back to her old self. Last I saw, anyway.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Rob Ocelot
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 07 December 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 795
Posted: 11 November 2017 at 11:29am | IP Logged | 20 post reply

To my tastes, for a character like Waller to get to the powerful position she's in had to be both physically and mentally imposing -- and each aspect reinforces the other.  Someone you don't cross, mess, or even mince words with.  Unfortunately, "Tall" is the usual on screen shorthand for a woman who's "physically imposing" and our screens are littered with characters who have the stature of an Amazon.

Many good casting choices out there if you look hard enough.

As someone above mentioned, CCH Pounder not only looks the part IRL but she also gave the perfect voice to the part in the DCAU.

I would also suggest Marsha Warfield, but I believe she's retired from acting these days.
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
Adam Schulman
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 22 July 2017
Posts: 230
Posted: 11 November 2017 at 12:19pm | IP Logged | 21 post reply

The DC Animated Universe version of Waller was perfect.

Particularly her "relationship" with Batman. 
Back to Top profile | search
 
Eric Sofer
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 31 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 1581
Posted: 12 November 2017 at 9:16am | IP Logged | 22 post reply

ITEM: The Justice League Unlimited episode "Epilogue" featured an older Amanda Waller, and it was a sheer delight. Okay, okay, I'm a Batman Beyond whore, I grant you. It was still a great episode.

ITEM: I respect good acting of a part. But is it complimentary to say of an actor that she looks as if she would make a great Amanda Waller? I know that "cross casting" should not work in this case; a heavy black woman is required. But... I wonder how it would be received?
Back to Top profile | search
 
Steven Ely
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 13 February 2013
Location: United States
Posts: 162
Posted: 12 November 2017 at 4:35pm | IP Logged | 23 post reply

Gabourey Sidibe should get the role of Amanda Waller...

...And how about a remake that's an actual faithful adaption of the original Suicide Squad... Blockbuster, Enchantress, Captain Boomerang, African American Bronze Tiger and Caucasian Deadshot versus Darkseid's Brimstone monster. Plus if it's a movie adaption of LEGENDS, it could have Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman, etc. all in it, too.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Mike Norris
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3882
Posted: 12 November 2017 at 6:14pm | IP Logged | 24 post reply

She's a bit young at 34 to be Amanda, who I picture as being 10 or even 20 years older. 
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
Steven Ely
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 13 February 2013
Location: United States
Posts: 162
Posted: 12 November 2017 at 7:03pm | IP Logged | 25 post reply

Getting a bit anal now. Gabourey Sidibe at 34 years old is really too young for Amanda Waller? Nell Carter was 38 in 1986 when Amanda Waller was created, JB explained that Nell Carter was the bases for the character. Actual age numbers of actors doesn't really matter so long as they look the part and can act.


Edited by Steven Ely on 12 November 2017 at 9:04pm
Back to Top profile | search
 

Page of 2 Next >>
  Post ReplyPost New Topic
Printable version Printable version

Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot create polls in this forum
You can vote in polls in this forum

 Active Topics | Member List | Search | Help | Register | Login