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Rebecca Jansen
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Posted: 17 February 2018 at 9:16pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Just for the heck of it there should be a comic or series titled "The Old Superheroes Home, Fortress Of Solitude Branch" I'd love to see them with walkers and bad backs and cranky as anything waiting for their time to enter cold storage. Batgirl has had a couple facelifts too many, Hawkman is a vitamin popping raw foods nut with a toupee. Supergirl I & II are employed as day nurse (Kryptonian) and night nurse (the Proty type blob one). The plot could be an epic canasta tournament against the Old Supervillains Home, Perth Amboy, NJ Branch, and both sides keep getting caught out for cheating. Look out 'House Of Ideas'! :^)

I have too much time on my hands, sorry.


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Wallace Sellars
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Posted: 17 February 2018 at 9:33pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

I have yet to hear or read any good arguments for aging these
characters.

John Romita’s Spider-Man may be my favorite, but Peter Parker still
should have remained a high school student,
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Brian O'Neill
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Posted: 17 February 2018 at 10:32pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Wallace:
...Peter Parker still 
should have remained a high school student.
**************************************************

The obvious argument against that: He didn't meet Gwen until he started college. That's when the book really became worth reading when the star was out of costume.

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James Woodcock
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Posted: 18 February 2018 at 12:17am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

By aging characters you instantly take them away from who they were/are. Add in that every writer seems to need to make their mark on a character and you end up with where we  are.

A situation where, people can say, yes these characters have aged, but no one recognises them as the character they remember. So who would buy them?
Nostalgia buyers see someone they don’t recognise, probably don’t like.
Potential new readers see someone with an incredible weight of history on each character’s shoulders that seems impenetrable.

So the only people who buy them are the ones that demanded they were ruined.

Meanwhile marketing remind us all the time about who they were because they understand that what the people actually respond to are the original versions of the character. And those are the ones who appear on the marketing when it comes to images actually taken from comics.
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Mike Norris
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Posted: 18 February 2018 at 12:31am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

As for JSA and Infinity Inc. -- this only became a problem when Earth-Two was erased. Thomas clearly wanted all Earth-Two characters to live and die in real time. After Crisis (lord, I hate mentioning that name yet again) this was no longer possible. 
************************************************************ ***********************
Live maybe, but I don't think he was interested in them dying. He went to great lengths to slow their aging so they could be used modern day stories. The only thing  that Crisis did was eliminate the multiple Earths and the 'problematic" characters. It was Roy who decided the rest of the JSA needed to be swept into limbo. Of course later they were brought back and their continuity was folded into the merged Earth. Easier in the 90's than today though.

Part of the problem is fans and some pros are obsessed with the minutia and window dressing over the characters and the story. Peter Parker's bellbottoms and sideburns are suddenly as important as his relationships with Aunt May and Mary Jane. 
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Eric Jansen
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Posted: 18 February 2018 at 2:30am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

"Soap opera characters are played by actors who age."

And sometimes they're recast because the actors aren't aging fast enough!  A lot of babies suddenly become teenagers and a lot of teenage characters suddenly become 20-somethings--all to open up story possibilities!

But I'm not the one who included soap opera elements into Marvel comics, that was Stan Lee!  And he was right!  I was always at least as interested in what was happening in Peter Parker's private life as I was in the super-heroics of Spider-Man.  And a lot of that was tied to his aging and time passing.

Honestly looking at the big picture, I don't want a 16 year-old Spider-Man.  I don't even want a 19 year-old Spider-Man.  I'm perfectly happy with a 25-28 year-old Spider-Man!  Younger than most of his fellow heroes, but not a kid.  I enjoyed Ditko's kid Spider-Man, I can't see anybody else matching that.

Most of Marvel's big guns don't need to be kept "forever young."  Tony Stark could be 50 and it wouldn't hurt anything (in many ways it would make sense), Bruce Banner should be at least 45 (it's weird to see him still being drawn as 30 years old--he NEVER should have looked 30 years old), Steve Rogers was always younger than he seemed (taking into account only his unfrozen years) but he always acted older (and his Super-Soldier serum would keep him spry no matter how much he aged), I always thought Reed Richards was at least 45 (and it surprised me when his 40th birthday was celebrated), and time passing doesn't really matter for Thor, Dr. Strange, Nick Fury, Sub-Mariner, the Silver Surfer, and more.  I think aging the characters just a FEW years (maybe 10-12 from when they started) would just add depth and story possibilities.

On the other hand, FREEZE everybody at DC!  Besides Superman and Batman, I would love to see Green Lantern, Hawkman, Aquaman, Green Arrow, and even Wonder Woman made more "written in stone."  Batman can have 1,000 great stories where absolutely nothing has to change in his life--Alfred takes care of the mansion, Bruce Wayne is a playboy, Commissioner Gordon is in charge of the police, and Batman goes out every night to fight crime.  It's only when they throw in a city-altering earthquake, a broken back, a crippled Batgirl, a dead Robin, an obnoxious son--things like that--that Batman gets ruined a bit.  A similar argument can be made for Superman and his status quo.  I WISH Green Lantern, Hawkman, and the rest had a timeless set-up like those two.  Time passing for the DC heroes always seems to ruin things.


Edited by Eric Jansen on 18 February 2018 at 2:34am
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James Woodcock
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Posted: 18 February 2018 at 3:30am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

I think we forget what age appears to be to children.
A 16 year old Spider-man is relatable. 30 is about dad’s age. 50 is grandparents age.

Look at the age of superheroes from that perspective and not from an adult perspective and you have a completely different view on how old these characters should be
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Adam Schulman
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Posted: 18 February 2018 at 4:32am | IP Logged | 8 post reply

It may be a moot point now. Even if suddenly comics were back on newstands and everything in every superhero title was back to where it was circa 1975...kids would rather play video games on their phones. From what I'm told they don't even watch cartoons much anymore.

I've met lots of 20-somethings who grew up reading superhero comics but those aren't "kids" anymore. Maybe Marvel could engage in greater effort to get the "18-to-34 demographic" that enjoys the Marvel movies to read their comics. But hey, why bother? The comics are basically R&D for the movies now. Who at Disney cares if they sell or not?

Anyway, a 30-year-old Spider-Man could be an interesting character but he's very far from what Lee and Ditko intended. He'd have to be far less about making mistakes than someone who just has bad things happen to him -- and that's not very different from other Marvel characters who've led pretty miserable lives (Matt Murdock most of the time, Bruce Banner all of the time, and son).
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Matthew Wilkie
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Posted: 18 February 2018 at 5:12am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

Some of what is described above can come with character progression than doesn't significantly change the character but moves the narrative along. When the writer leaves, whoever takes over doesn't have to inherit a mess. This is different to seeing characters age in real time.

Interestingly, it wasn't until I started coming to this forum that I had even considered that comic book characters didn't age, that Spider-Man had been published for goodness knows how many years and yet Peter Parker was still a young man; it has never even entered my head.
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Eric Jansen
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Posted: 18 February 2018 at 6:51am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

I think we forget what age appears to be to children.  A 16 year old Spider-man is relatable. 30 is about dad’s age. 50 is grandparents age.

Look at the age of superheroes from that perspective and not from an adult perspective and you have a completely different view on how old these characters should be
_____________________________

I don't know.  When I started reading these comics at 9 years old in the 70's, I pretty much assumed Superman, Batman, Bruce Banner, Wolverine were all about 40 years old, and I was fine with that.  (I remember being surprised every time DC insisted that the Curt Swan Superman was only--and always--29 years old!  He looked like my Dad!)  Besides hairlines and broad chests, these guys acted older.  I knew Spider-Man was in his 20's, and I could relate to that.  (Kids always relate up.)  The Teen Titans were the only ones that were "kids" and they were less interesting to me.  (I was pretty sure that the Legion were all in their 20's, even before the story that spelled it out.)

Reading later how popular Marvel comics were on college campuses made perfect sense.  Not sure if Stan Lee learned that before or after he sent Peter Parker to college but it was clear early on that Marvel was going after an older demographic than the supposedly more "kiddy-friendly" DC.


Edited by Eric Jansen on 18 February 2018 at 6:51am
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Eric Jansen
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Posted: 18 February 2018 at 7:14am | IP Logged | 11 post reply

It's funny to compare this thread to the BLACK LIGHTNING thread over in the TV section.

I can't really stand what they've done to Black Lightning (on the show or in the comics), giving him powers and two teenage/adult daughters.  Somehow, this ex-Olympic athlete turned youthful teacher has aged 20 years while the heroes around him aged ten or less.  And Green Arrow had an adult son too, didn't he?  (I missed the whole story on that.)  And then Roy Harper, Aqualad, and Wally West all had kids too.

Ah DC, thy name is NOT consistency!
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Wallace Sellars
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Posted: 18 February 2018 at 7:47am | IP Logged | 12 post reply

The obvious argument against that: He didn't meet Gwen until he
started college. That's when the book really became worth reading
when the star was out of costume.

—-

Aaaand I still haven’t read a good reason.

As a former high school administrator and teacher, I can say with
confidence that there is enough room for relationship drama in that
setting to make moving Peter to college unnecessary.
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