Active Topics | Member List | Search | Help | Register | Login
The John Byrne Forum
Byrne Robotics > The John Byrne Forum << Prev Page of 4 Next >>
Topic: Another school shooting Post ReplyPost New Topic
Author
Message
Jeff Scott
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 27 November 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 238
Posted: 18 May 2018 at 6:56pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

This world is going insane!!
Back to Top profile | search
 
Steven Myers
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 10 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5624
Posted: 18 May 2018 at 7:58pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

I think those of the next generation that survive are going to be pretty sick of guns. By that, I mean the easy access (see comment on Canada above) mostly. Change can happen, and victims/friends/relatives are a major force. It happened with our DUI laws and attitude. So don't give up! 
Back to Top profile | search | www
 
Michael Sommerville
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 12 April 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 417
Posted: 19 May 2018 at 1:53am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

What gun control laws would have prevented this shooting?  What gun laws would have kept these guns out of this persons hands? The one nobody is willing to say because it is an impossibility. Take away the second amendment and the NRA, it will not take away the guns. Few countries have a right to bear arms but most allow access to some types of guns. The only way these shootings will be stopped is taking away all guns but nobody will say it. 

I keep hearing, listen to the children, but that is not a solution. This issue is more complex than no NRA money, assault rifle bans or trying to get the "right" people elected. The last Democratic controlled Congress and Presidency did not enact stricter laws. Again, the guns used, in this shooting, are ones a majority of Americans do not oppose. 

Stop the blame and condemnation of those other than the killers. No one wants kids to die, not even the NRA, anti-gun control people and politicians. Put forward attainable goals, take those baby steps and get closer. Any progress gets you closer to the win, standing still demanding that you win gets you nowhere.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
Posted: 19 May 2018 at 3:44am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Can't take away the guns, but stop all production and importation of bullets and gunpowder. The gun freaks will run out of bullets to shoot sooner or later. 
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
Leigh DJ Hunt
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 20 February 2008
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 1570
Posted: 19 May 2018 at 5:10am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Saw a police statement refer to it as an "unthinkable tragedy". How is it unthinkable when it happens so often.

Far more real was a student who when asked if she ever thought such a terrible thing could happen in her school answered 'yes, of course, it was always on her mind that it would'. What an awful thing for kids to have to stress about on top of everything else.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Steven Myers
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 10 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5624
Posted: 19 May 2018 at 6:59am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

What gun control laws would have prevented this shooting?
----------------------

Just because we can't prevent every gun death, doesn't mean we can't reduce the number. As my example of DUIs, we haven't gotten the DUI number to zero, but we have cut it by more than half since we got serious about DUI laws.

What does the science say? https://www.cbsnews.com/news/50-state-study-more-g un-laws-fewer-deaths/


Back to Top profile | search | www
 
John Byrne
Avatar
Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132275
Posted: 19 May 2018 at 8:47am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Currently I'm rereading THE LAST GUNFIGHT, by Jeff Guinn, and I'm reminded yet again that too many Americans imagine themselves as literal sons of the pioneers, ready to defend themselves against all comers -- even the Government.
Back to Top profile | search
 
John Byrne
Avatar
Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132275
Posted: 19 May 2018 at 8:50am | IP Logged | 8 post reply

...too soon to talk about gun control.

•••

"Well, Mr Jones, you have a very advanced case of cancer, but it's too soon to talk about it."

Back to Top profile | search
 
Eric Sofer
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 31 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 4789
Posted: 19 May 2018 at 9:35am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

Michael S., you refer to this shooting and this shooter, and what gun laws would have stopped this. I have heard this from many corners... "a control on assault rifles wouldn't stop a shooter from using a handgun in this tragedy."

Referring to a single incident and how could it have been stopped has, as has been noted under separate cover, one simple solution; shoot the attacker before he can kill anyone. One death instead of multiple.

This concept is preposterous. Even if somehow protection could be provided to so many different venues - even just schools - would be expensive, inefficient, and treatment of a symptom - not a problem. And not only do I feel that it would stop shootings, but some of these insane bastards might see it as a CHALLENGE!

Gun control laws - even mild ones - will not change anything today, or tomorrow, or next Wednesday. But they WILL change things in a few years, even if only to a limited degree, and as Michael S. splendidly observed - TAKE THOSE BABY STEPS.

Had such legislation been enacted ten years ago, we might not be discussing that such occurrences seem to be a daily event - or even four or five times weekly. The river doesn't start and immediately hit the bottom of the mountain - but it WILL get there, and when it does, the effects will be impressive.

Just because an action doesn't have immediate effect is no indicator that it will not do tremendous good in the future. Investing and Social Security are predicated on that concept.
Back to Top profile | search
 
James Johnson
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 16 March 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 2057
Posted: 19 May 2018 at 2:24pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

The National Door Association (NDA) is not going to like this plan.

Politicians could lose millions in funding. 

:-/
Back to Top profile | search
 
Peter Martin
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 17 March 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 15793
Posted: 19 May 2018 at 6:11pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

 Stop the blame and condemnation of those other than the killers
------------------------------------------------------------ ----
This is a pretty bury-your-head-in-the-sand notion. Never regulate anything, because it is never the fault of anyone who shapes society on a large-scale, merely the actions of the individual that is to blame.

There is a problem on which we can all agree, as you alluded to in your post, Michael, which is kids being shot to death. It sounds like you understand the problem stems from too many guns.

Where we diverge is that you say the guns are already here and tightening regulations will not get rid of those guns.

However, consider when cars were built without seatbelts and fatalities from road accidents were far higher. Laws were enacted to remedy the problem. Car manufacturers were forced to put belts in new cars. Old cars remained grandfathered in. The millions of extant, unsafe cars were not an argument for maintaining the old, flawed regulations. In time, the cars with seatbelts outnumbered the less safe ones. Then regulations were tightened further to make wearing the damn things compulsory. Then they decided that having belts in the back should be compulsory. Once again, all the millions of cars on the road that didn't have belts in the back, did not mean that this new law was pointless or destined to fail. It just needed time.

The argument that a law that will prevent deaths in the longterm is pointless because it will not immediately prevent a death in the now is an empty argument. 


Edited by Peter Martin on 19 May 2018 at 6:12pm
Back to Top profile | search
 
Rebecca Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 12 February 2018
Location: Canada
Posts: 4520
Posted: 19 May 2018 at 7:14pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Or we can simply wait until someone can invent bulletproof bodies stockings for everyone. That might happen sooner than the human species becomes logical and sane.
Back to Top profile | search | www e-mail
 

<< Prev Page of 4 Next >>
  Post ReplyPost New Topic
Printable version Printable version

Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot create polls in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

 Active Topics | Member List | Search | Help | Register | Login