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John Byrne
Imaginary X-Man
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 115119
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| Posted: 08 October 2018 at 8:41am | IP Logged | 1
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And not in a good way. LINK
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Eric Sofer
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 2877
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| Posted: 08 October 2018 at 9:54am | IP Logged | 2
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Not with a president and Congress who pull out of the Paris accords and aren't smart enough to know that Global Warming and Climate Change are the same damned thing. We're screwed.
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Robbie Parry
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 12187
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| Posted: 08 October 2018 at 10:08am | IP Logged | 3
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What doesn't help are here today, gone tomorrow politicians.
Off the top of my head, I can't tell you who our Climate Secretary is. He/she will be replaced next time there's an election. That's a position that certainly could do with a committed person for life.
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David Allen Perrin
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 April 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 2692
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 2:07am | IP Logged | 4
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Lifetime appointments are not necessarily a good idea. For anything.
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Petter Myhr Ness
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 02 July 2009
Location: Norway
Posts: 3015
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 3:28am | IP Logged | 5
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Lifetime appointments are not necessarily a good idea. For anything.--
Absolutely agree. Poland got in trouble for introducing retirement age for their supreme court judges, though. Critics argued that it was an attempt by the government to replace judges with THEIR people. Which it probably was, but I still think it beats lifetime appointments.
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12120
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 4:25am | IP Logged | 6
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As it was explained to me, us humans are biological weirdos as our metabolism can tolerate wide fluctuations in temperature. Not so for many animals. A few degrees off in the climate and entire species can go extinct, because they can't handle the heat (or cold).
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Koroush Ghazi
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 October 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 1173
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 6:37am | IP Logged | 7
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I'm not concerned. Jesus and his dad have got this covered. The Bible describes the End Time and the coming of a spaghetti-haired prophet who will "...deliver his message to us as if by birdsong" (a reference to Twitter), speaking in Tongues which we will not understand, and ultimately lead us to the Kingdom of Heaven (presumably a new Trump Casino in Las Vegas).
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John Byrne
Imaginary X-Man
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 115119
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 6:55am | IP Logged | 8
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As it was explained to me, us humans are biological weirdos as our metabolism can tolerate wide fluctuations in temperature. Not so for many animals. A few degrees off in the climate and entire species can go extinct, because they can't handle the heat (or cold). •• As far as humans, that's a bit broad. Only about 2% of the Earth's surface accommodates us in our natural state. Adapting the environment to suit our needs its what's gotten us in this trouble!
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Jabari Lamar
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 18 October 2017
Location: United States
Posts: 250
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 4:31pm | IP Logged | 9
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As Agent Smith said, we're like a virus...
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Jozef Brandt
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 03 March 2007
Location: United States
Posts: 2447
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 5:22pm | IP Logged | 10
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When I was in high school in the 90s, they hit is over the head with dire predictions about global warming and *none* of them have come true. That's why these scare reports are meaningless to me. The person teaching our AP Biology class said that by the year 2010, Crater Lake (in Oregon) would be nothing more than a mudhole, she said the arctic passages would be easy sailing year round, she said snow would be a distant memory in our hemisphere, she said polar bears would die out.
None of these things have happened.
Furthermore, when the UN comes out with these scare reports, the "solution" is always massive redistribution of wealth for some reason. I suppose you could say that the UN has always been goal oriented.
Michael Crichton had a book about this whole thing (State of Fear), and even testified to congress about climate models, talking about how Michael Mann's computer model created a hockey stick graph even if fed random data. There was also climategate where leaked emails proved that climate scientists were cooking the data in order to hide their own inconvenient truths. (eg. "Hide the decline" in temps).
We will be fine.
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Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12747
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 5:48pm | IP Logged | 11
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QUOTE:
| Michael Crichton had a book about this whole thing (State of Fear), and even testified to congress about climate models, talking about how Michael Mann's computer model created a hockey stick graph even if fed random data. |
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Michael Crichton was an enjoyable sci-go writer and a well-educated guy, but I don’t know why he’d be considered an authority on climate science.
QUOTE:
| There was also climategate where leaked emails proved that climate scientists were cooking the data in order to hide their own inconvenient truths. (eg. "Hide the decline" in temps). |
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This is an incorrect statement. Multiple investigations turned up no wrongdoing. What had happened is a bunch of non-scientists with an agenda took comments out of context.
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Koroush Ghazi
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 October 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 1173
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 6:33pm | IP Logged | 12
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I think Jozef's reply pretty much nails why JB's thread title is a 100% accurate prediction of the state of affairs. That's why my initial reply in this thread was so flippant.
If we're being serious, the fact of the matter is that there's simply no way we can convince a largely uneducated and/or willfully ignorant, self-centered, global population that we are destroying our own planet. Especially when there are people in positions of authority who reinforce the self-serving message that climate change scientists are wrong, but they, as politicians, are right.
The human race will continue to breed like locusts and abuse our resources until a major correction wipes out or significantly diminishes the number of humans on this planet. Nature, unlike the kind old man in the sky, does not pretend to be particularly forgiving or kind.
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John Byrne
Imaginary X-Man
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 115119
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 7:22pm | IP Logged | 13
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We will be fine. ••• I rest my case.
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Conrad Teves
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 1598
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 10:15pm | IP Logged | 14
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For the interested, here is an interactive map showing sea level rise and the number of people that would be displaced by it in a given country.
[Edited to add] If completely melted,
The Greenland Ice Sheet by itself would add 7 meters of sea level rise. The West Antarctic Ice sheet about 3 meters, and the East Antarctic Ice sheet about 60 meters.
Edited by Conrad Teves on 09 October 2018 at 10:18pm
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Jabari Lamar
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 18 October 2017
Location: United States
Posts: 250
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| Posted: 09 October 2018 at 10:35pm | IP Logged | 15
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I used to always think that one of the more unrealistic points in Superman's origin (y'know, beside the whole, "he's an alien from another planet" scenario in the first place) was that a highly advanced civilization like Krypton could blatantly ignore the signs of their planet's destruction until it was too late.
I get it now.
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Greg McPhee
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 August 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 4011
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| Posted: 10 October 2018 at 2:17am | IP Logged | 16
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Michael Crichton had a book about this whole thing (State of Fear), and even testified to congress about climate models, talking about how Michael Mann's computer model created a hockey stick graph even if fed random data. There was also climategate where leaked emails proved that climate scientists were cooking the data in order to hide their own inconvenient truths. (eg. "Hide the decline" in temps).
========================================================
I read "State of Fear", and just took it like Michael Crichton's other novels, he was giving a sense of verisimilitude to the book as he had done with others to make the whole scenario seem plausible.
It has been a while since I read it, but Crichton in his afterword talked about environmental and wilderness protection, and stated that the reader could review his sources and draw their own conclusions. I don't think he put himself forward as an authority as he finished along the lines of "...this is a work of fiction".
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Andrew Bitner
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5692
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| Posted: 10 October 2018 at 12:08pm | IP Logged | 17
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We're not going to be "fine"-- and even the next few generations will be royally screwed-- if we don't take action as quickly and decisively as possible.
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John Byrne
Imaginary X-Man
Joined: 11 May 2005
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| Posted: 10 October 2018 at 12:26pm | IP Logged | 18
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My Dad was writing about environmental pollution in a town planning magazine he edited when I was around 15. For those keeping track, that was more than 50 years ago.Many of the dire conditions predicted then did NOT, in fact, come to pass -- at least, not to the extent feared. But others, even more dire, then beyond our ability to predict, have made their presence felt. According to recent stone cold sober reports, if all emissions of greenhouse gases were cut to ZERO starting TODAY, the Earth would continue to warm for 200 years. Surely nobody's definition of "fine".
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Andrew Bitner
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Joined: 01 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5692
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| Posted: 10 October 2018 at 1:04pm | IP Logged | 19
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Our world view is not built to comprehend the ongoing effect of something as large as climate change. But we can use the intellect evolution built into us to push past those biological limitations.
It's true. The impact of so much carbon pushed into the atmosphere will not be mitigated by itself for decades to come, at best. There MIGHT be technology to help, but who's going to pony up billions now to save future generations? That's not good business, you see.
Some will say, "But it hasn't happened yet!"
By the time it is undeniable, even to the most thick-headed denier, it will be far too late. By the time a car has gone through the rails and off the edge of a cliff, it's too late to steer to safety-- and how far are we from the edge right now?
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Jabari Lamar
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 18 October 2017
Location: United States
Posts: 250
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| Posted: 10 October 2018 at 2:40pm | IP Logged | 20
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Just move along, nothing to see here, everything's normal...
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Shane Matlock
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 August 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 1538
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| Posted: 11 October 2018 at 12:11am | IP Logged | 21
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Hard to believe that some folks are still in denial about climate change when you can actually see major changes in weather and temperature happening.
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Jabari Lamar
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 18 October 2017
Location: United States
Posts: 250
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| Posted: 11 October 2018 at 8:40am | IP Logged | 22
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The common argument is that any climate changes that happen are just "natural" changes in the planet's weather that occur on their own, and that humans have zero effect on it.
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John Byrne
Imaginary X-Man
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 115119
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| Posted: 11 October 2018 at 8:43am | IP Logged | 23
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For a long time I was not convinced that humans were directly affecting climate change. After all, the Earth has experienced wild swings in climate without humans even being here. However, the weight of evidence has simply become too great.
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