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Eric Sofer
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Posted: 28 January 2019 at 10:47am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Mr. Byrne - thanks! I thought I recalled (perhaps from a Denny O'Neil story) that the Waynes had gone to see "The Mask of Zorro" that night.

My memory's obviously not good enough - was there in fact some event that the Waynes had gone to, or were they just out on a nice Gotham night when the murders occurred? (And please be sure that I'm referring to pre-Crisis continuity. I don't care about any of the "realities" after that.)
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 28 January 2019 at 10:51am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

Coincidentally, I came across this article, last week:

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John Byrne
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Posted: 28 January 2019 at 11:50am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

That article falls under the heading of what I call "The Earth Cooled..." answer. Ask a simple question. get several pages of answers that have nothing to do with it. Like saying, "How as your day?" and getting, "Well, the Earth cooled..." as the start of an answer.

This is the kind of thinking that leads to some writers developing a bad case of Footnote Fever.

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John Byrne
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Posted: 28 January 2019 at 11:52am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

(I've mentioned before that Chris Claremont and I were at a con in Toronto, not long after the Death of Phoenix, and a fan in the audience asked if we had considered having Jean use her power to "cure" Scott's eyebeams before we got rid of her. Chris leaned forward and began "Well, you have to understand the complexity of the relationship between Scott and Jean..." I cut him off with "Chris, the answer to that question is 'no'.")
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Greg Kirkman
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Posted: 28 January 2019 at 12:01pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

That article falls under the heading of what I call "The Earth Cooled..." answer. Ask a simple question. get several pages of answers that have nothing to do with it. Like saying, "How as your day?" and getting, "Well, the Earth cooled..." as the start of an answer.

This is the kind of thinking that leads to some writers developing a bad case of Footnote Fever.

+++++++


Pretty much. Having to wade through pages of extraneous detail to get a simple answer to a simple question is standard procedure, these days. But, without all of that filler, there wouldn’t be an article, would there?  

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Brennan Voboril
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Posted: 28 January 2019 at 6:06pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

I like that "no" very much.  I found Mr. Claremont's work to be verbose, among other things.  This opinion might qualify as heresy for some, but I much preferred when you went to the FF and wrote the book yourself.  After all the years have passed, the FF stands out much more than the Uncanny run.  What's that they say?  Second to Lee-Kirby?  Ain't that the truth? 
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Mario Ribeiro
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Posted: 29 January 2019 at 7:28am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

That article falls under the heading of what I call "The Earth Cooled..." answer. Ask a simple question. get several pages of answers that have nothing to do with it. Like saying, "How as your day?" and getting, "Well, the Earth cooled..." as the start of an answer.

+++++++


Once I saw an old sexploitation movie that took place in a trial. A witness took the stand, the lawyer asked her: "Do you remember what happened that day?" And she said: "Oh, sure, very well. I was taking a shower..." Then we saw her taking a long shower, then she dried her body, then she got dressed, looked herself into the mirror, didn't like it, so she removed her clothes and put on something else. Then she left her home and whatever was relevant to her testimony finally happened. I remember thinking: "Objection, your honor! Irrelevant!"
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John Byrne
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Posted: 29 January 2019 at 8:33am | IP Logged | 8 post reply

“Irrelevant” is a word many writers need to learn!
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Joe S. Walker
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Posted: 29 January 2019 at 10:27am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

My personal response to that establishing-the-movie stuff was "For f***'s sake. Why not do a story showing what colour underwear he had on that night?"
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John Byrne
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Posted: 29 January 2019 at 10:38am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

Pink.
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Doug Centers
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Posted: 29 January 2019 at 11:02am | IP Logged | 11 post reply

Hey, I get that reference!
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Eric Sofer
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Posted: 29 January 2019 at 11:56am | IP Logged | 12 post reply

I like pink very much, John.

"Fixing" Cyclops might well be done at some point - it surely seems as if Claremont wanted to in the X-Men/Alpha Flight two parter - but that's where we mess with continuity again.

In the Marvel universe far more than in the DCU, there are characters who need (or at least needed) to be physically "fixed" in this manner - Don Blake was lame, Tony Stark lived on death's edge with that shrapnel, Matt Murdock was blind, Bruce Banner was the Hulk, and so on.

But "fixing" them messes up that continuity again! It changes the characters too far, and messes up their motivations.

Unfortunately, it's too easy, and I have no idea if current Marvel heroes have been "fixed" or not. But what would that have done to Cyclops, for example? No longer constantly worried about hurting or killing someone... what direction would his personality have gone?

Or one of the biggest ones - our Mr. Byrne had Franklin Richards change the Thing. At that point, Ben Grimm had the dinosaur epidermis again, and it was irreversible by any standard methods; it needed "wish magic" to change him back to rocky skin, which is what Franklin did, so that Ben's mental attitude wouldn't be devastated.

What if he had gone a different direction? "Uncle Ben is so sad with dino skin... and he's accepted rocky skin, but it still makes him sad. I'll just change him so that he looks like he used to, but still as strong and tough as the Thing!" And Ben Grimm goes back to his humanic form, but still as strong as the Hulk (give or take.)

Yeah, it's a reasonable direction. It might even work. But it destroys the nature of the character. Remember, these are comic characters, not real people; some of them are SUPPOSED to have flaws. Superman and Manhunter from Mars gotta have weaknesses. Bruce Wayne's and Dick Grayson's parents have to have died*.Green Lanterns have to have a weakness.

*Although Alan Brennert did an excellent alternate take on this in his "To Kill A Legend" in Detective Comics #500.

Normal people - even with super powers - aren't as interesting as those with twists or flaws, physical or emotional. Shucks, Stan knew that when he created Spider-Man and the Fantastic Four. Considering how things turned out after that... maybe he was right.
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