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Conrad Teves
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Posted: 03 June 2019 at 1:54pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Alternate-history show.  What if the Russians landed on the Moon first?
Intriguing...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZS9M52Bd_w
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Brian Floyd
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Posted: 03 June 2019 at 5:10pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

Kinda disappointed the title has nothing to do with Mick Foley.....


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Mark Haslett
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Posted: 03 June 2019 at 5:33pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

What the hell?
What a cool idea.
How many episodes?

edit: can't find a number episodes online, but in a nutshell it's about "what if
the global space race had never ended?"

Edited by Mark Haslett on 03 June 2019 at 5:38pm
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Mark Haslett
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Posted: 03 June 2019 at 5:39pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

I recently talked to a JPL engineer who told me about the US plan to send
someone to Mars in the 70's -- a plan that was scrapped after interest in
Apollo waned.
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Koroush Ghazi
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Posted: 04 June 2019 at 8:13am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

We kinda touched on this in the Moon thread I had on the main forum a few days ago. Perhaps I'm missing something, but how does this premise remotely meet any sanity test for being remotely plausible?

The trailer seems to present the idea that if Russia had beaten the US to the Moon, that this would (a) indicate some sort of pre-apocalyptic prophesy come true; and (b) that there would somehow be an explosion of technological advancement such that the US - and presumably Russia - would be reaching other planets shortly thereafter. What? How? With magic?

I see the brief glimpse of Reese Witherspoon's character indicates the obligatory retconning of "sassy, strong-willed female character circa 2020" into the 1960s space race.

Also, square-jawed crew-cut men racing multiple Corvettes, nationalistic jingoism reminiscent of Trump's Space Force speeches... What's not to like?

PASS.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 04 June 2019 at 8:26am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

As most of you know, Iím not one for conspiracy theories, but I did come close to flirting with one during and after Apollo XIII. Interest in the Moon flights did, indeed, take a precipitous nose dive after Apollo XI, and I wondered briefly if the whole disaster had been staged to rekindle interest.
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Mark Haslett
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Posted: 04 June 2019 at 10:37am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Koroush: The trailer seems to present the idea that if Russia had beaten the
US to the Moon, that this would (a) indicate some sort of pre-apocalyptic
prophesy come true; and (b) that there would somehow be an explosion of
technological advancement such that the US - and presumably Russia -
would be reaching other planets shortly thereafter. What? How? With
magic?

**

No, with nuclear explosive propulsion. That was the plan under Nixon,
anyway.

Having just looked into this myself, maybe you'd be surprised as well, but
studies for Mars missions were a part of NASA since the early 60's. NASA
figured a Mars mission could be done with Saturn V technology. Then, after
the success of Apollo, a formal Mars proposal was presented with designs
that used nuclear-power. Nixon passed and the "space race" wound down.

The premise of this "alternative history" seems pretty simple to me: if USSR
got to the moon first, Nixon would have green-lit the trip to Mars. If NASA
had kept going at its 1960's pace, the technological breakthroughs of the
space race might have continued and badda-bing, badda-boom... a TV
show is born.

As to the prophecy, it's clearly an attempt to capture/portray the inevitable
fear that would come if our enemies got to the moon first.

Not expecting to change your mind here, BTW, just addressing the
implications of your criticisms.
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Koroush Ghazi
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Posted: 04 June 2019 at 4:10pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Sorry, I guess I was "triggered" as they say by the imagery and implications of this series.

Setting aside the substantial technical (and financial) challenges, which even if possible, may have seen the US bankrupt itself and wind up losing the Cold War the way Russia eventually did, it's the outright ultra-nationalistic tone of this that galls me, set as it is against the backdrop of one of the greatest achievements of science, and one which - whatever the self-serving political reasons behind it - brought together all of humanity (as per the title).

Turning that into cheap "What if them bad guys beat us to the Moon, we'll show them y'all!" fiction, especially during a time in which actual right-wing nationalism and xenophobia is on the rise, seems poor taste to say the least.

There is the possibility that this will be played as a parody of militaristic nationalism, ala the Starship Troopers movie. If it is, my apologies in advance. But the imagery shown in the trailer seems only to make it appear to be the average red-hat wearing numpty's wet dream about 'Murica being great again.

Looking at the way they can now simulate the visuals of the Moon landing so closely, it seems such a waste if the story being told is that regressive. I'd love to see what someone like JB could do with the story if given the resources Netflix throws at these shows. Nuanced is a word most of Hollywood has yet to discover.
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Conrad Teves
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Posted: 04 June 2019 at 4:14pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

Mark>>No, with nuclear explosive propulsion.<<

Clarification:  for Mars it wouldn't be nuclear *explosive* propulsion, rather a nuclear thermal.  Today we call the specific concept "NTR" for Nuclear Thermal Rocket to distinguish it from many other related concepts.  Back then it was NERVA, the office for which didn't close until 1972.  The NTR just floods the reactor chamber (instead of combustion chamber) with hydrogen, which heats up and shoots out the back.  The very light exhaust product means very high exhaust velocity nearly doubling the efficiency of chemical rockets.

Here's Von Braun's actual post Apollo 11 proposal from 1969:  Nasa Link

It's a pretty well thought out plan.  We know a bunch of stuff now that they didn't know, so we wouldn't do it that way today, but it has lots of nice details including an option to tumble the vehicle end over end for artificial gravity.  SpaceX has also noted that you can get NTR class performance out of chemical rockets if you just refuel your ships while they are still in Earth orbit. Three or two month transits become practical.  

The "explosive" nuclear propulsion, i.e., Project Orion was to use repetitive nuclear explosions to move the vehicle around the solar system.  I can recommend the "Project Orion" book by George Dyson if you are interested in learning more.
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Conrad Teves
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Posted: 04 June 2019 at 4:16pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

Koroush>> Nuanced is a word most of Hollywood has yet to discover.<<

Did you think the new Battlestar Galactic was nuanced?  Because this is Ron Moore's project.
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Koroush Ghazi
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Posted: 04 June 2019 at 4:19pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

Initially, yes, I thought it was.

The way it was all tied together at the end put paid to that, it turned out to just be "a whole bunch of stuff that happened", with pretensions of religious/spiritual/iraqi-war undertones.
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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 04 June 2019 at 4:52pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

it's the outright ultra-nationalistic tone of this that galls me, set as it is against the backdrop of one of the greatest achievements of science, and one which - whatever the self-serving political reasons behind it - brought together all of humanity (as per the title). 

óó-

The US stake in the Space Race was in beating the Commies. Letís not pretend otherwise. I also think you are looking at it as a non-American, as I think even a large portion of the pinko Socialist libruls that are destroying America would be unbothered by the imagery that you are describing as ultra-nationalistic.
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