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Bill Collins
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Joined: 26 May 2005
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Posted: 08 June 2019 at 4:32am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Brian, one of the reasons i`m bored with The Flash is
"Sherloque" etc!
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Vinny Valenti
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Posted: 08 June 2019 at 10:12am | IP Logged | 2 post reply


“HAPPY DAYS is responsible for the term "jumping the shark" from a season 5 episode, but it really didn't start going downhill until Ron Howard left (season 7), and really hit the toilet in season 9.”


It got really bad when they stopped bothering to dress like they were in the 50s/60s. The actors started rocking 80s perms and poufs. 


Edited by Vinny Valenti on 08 June 2019 at 11:30am
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Dave Phelps
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Posted: 08 June 2019 at 11:03am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

 Trevor Smith wrote:
A question inspired by the Friends reunion thread - when it comes to TV series, what do we *really* want, as viewers?


I would say what we "really want" is for the series to go out "naturally" and before any decline sets in, but the problem is that you don't know what bullets you've dodged if the episodes don't exist.

The ending of Angel Season Five left me wanting more, but if Season Six had aired and was terrible, I'd be saying that they should've stopped after five.

Long running series tend to evolve over time as the cast ages, old cast members move on, new cast members come in, original set-ups run their course, etc. The trick is make the new situations/relationships as (or even more) appealing than what you started with, which isn't always easy.
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Trevor Smith
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Posted: 08 June 2019 at 1:21pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

"I would say what we "really want" is for the series
to go out "naturally" and before any decline sets in,
but the problem is that you don't know what bullets
you've dodged if the episodes don't exist."

**

Exactly. And you can't even really go by just one
first, bad season. Who's to say that rather than
continue to decline, writers/creators don't look
around and say "well that was the drizzlings", pull up
their bootstraps, and come back with a vengeance the
following year? I say that I'd rather see a series go
out while still great, but even then I'd forgive ONE
bad season, I think.
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Rob Ocelot
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Posted: 09 June 2019 at 8:34am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

 Dave Phelps wrote:
I would say what we "really want" is for the series to go out "naturally" and before any decline sets in, but the problem is that you don't know what bullets you've dodged if the episodes don't exist.

I'd say the rot tends to creep in when shows are kept going because the money is still there.   It's harder to make coherent creative decisions when the tail is wagging the dog, so to speak.   Keeping a show going for those reasons always ends badly, IMO.

Inevitably the writers fall into the trap of shoving two characters into a relationship because of proximity or lack of anything else for the characters to be doing, introducing a new disposable love interest just to prop up a relationship between two series regulars, or writing cliche character-centric episodes (eg. "this one is a Kramer story") because they are popular/breakout.   

Once the writers begin crafting episodes they think will please the audience versus stories that ring true to the characters then it's all over.   Yes, you might get an amazing gem or two in those final seasons where they are going through the motions but you'll be picking those diamonds out of a big manure pile.  I've noticed lately that many shows now try every season to artifically replicate quirky experimental episodes you'd encounter in a final season -- you know the type, they are more often than not musicals or zany breaking-the-fourth-wall stuff.   Thing is, these episodes are more often than not borne out of desperation on the part of the writers ("hey, I just noticed that half our cast worked in musical theatre.  We should take advantage of that") versus good creative decisions.  Everyone remembers when it works brilliantly and conveniently forgets when it makes total garbage -- for every "Once More, With Feeling" (BUFFY) there's Webster crossing over with STAR TREK:TNG.

Best to end a show before you think you'll run out of ideas rather than demonstrate this to your audience onscreen and start to lose them.  

My all time favorite show that went out when they were on top and never declined in quality (and arguably that quality increased year to year) was BARNEY MILLER.


Edited by Rob Ocelot on 09 June 2019 at 8:35am
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Petter Myhr Ness
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Posted: 10 June 2019 at 6:59am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

I don't know. Some might say that the X-FILES went on at least a couple of seasons too long. But there were some good episodes in those final seasons. And though the end was dreadful, I was delighted when it returned - as a continuation, not a reboot.

I used to love BIG BANG THEORY, but gave up about four-five years ago. Have no interest in it now. But that doesn't mean I think they should have stopped making it when *I* lost interest. That's kinda arrogant. 

I feel a lot worse about shows that ended too quickly than the ones that may have outstayed their welcome.  
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Brian Rhodes
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Posted: 10 June 2019 at 4:38pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

SCRUBS had an awesome series finale.

Except, then it wasn't.

Though I tend to think of Season 9 as  "AfterSCRUBS"


Edited by Brian Rhodes on 11 June 2019 at 10:35am
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