Author |
|
Wallace Sellars Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 May 2004 Location: United States Posts: 17671
|
Posted: 23 July 2019 at 6:49am | IP Logged | 1
|
post reply
|
|
Sometimes I wish characters like the members of JB's Alpha Flight or Alan Davis' ClanDestine family were creator owned. Just imagine the wonderful stories we could have if the creators chose to tell them, and even if they didn't, the characters would be protected from being tarnished by those unsuitable to tell their tales.
(I know. I know. This attitude applied to the characters Stan, Jack, Steve and others created would have denied us many wonderful stories over the years.)
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
|
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 132320
|
Posted: 23 July 2019 at 6:49am | IP Logged | 2
|
post reply
|
|
"His accent sounds Russian."•• Which raises a curious point. Since Xavier used his telepathic powers to teach English to all those who didn't already speak it, would they not have whatever accent HE has?
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 132320
|
Posted: 23 July 2019 at 7:53am | IP Logged | 3
|
post reply
|
|
(I know. I know. This attitude applied to the characters Stan, Jack, Steve and others created would have denied us many wonderful stories over the years.)•• A reminder that the FANS actually fared better when the Pros were treated as wage slaves, with no rights at all!!
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Shawn Kane Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 November 2010 Location: United States Posts: 3239
|
Posted: 23 July 2019 at 7:58am | IP Logged | 4
|
post reply
|
|
Wallace, I blame editors more than writers for tarnishing the characters. JMS could say "Gwen and Norman's kids" or "Spider Totem" and Ed Brubaker could say "I'm bringing Bucky back" or "Dark Genesis" and an editor or Editor-in-Chief could say "No". Of course, we've been told that some editors insert too much of their power as well (I'm thinking of things like The Beyonder and Quasar being forced upon writers).
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Peter Martin Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 March 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 15811
|
Posted: 23 July 2019 at 8:58am | IP Logged | 5
|
post reply
|
|
Since Xavier used his telepathic powers to teach English to all those who didn't already speak it, would they not have whatever accent HE has?---------------------------- Maybe the muscle memory isn't there for certain sounds, leaving clues to the native accent (I'm thinking, for example, of the 'th' sound that so many non-native English speakers struggle with even though they know how it should sound).
Edited by Peter Martin on 23 July 2019 at 8:59am
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Brian Miller Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004 Location: United States Posts: 30901
|
Posted: 23 July 2019 at 11:01am | IP Logged | 6
|
post reply
|
|
Which raises a curious point. Since Xavier used his telepathic powers to teach English to all those who didn't already speak it, would they not have whatever accent HE has?
***********
🤯
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Rob Ocelot Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 December 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1231
|
Posted: 29 July 2019 at 5:01am | IP Logged | 7
|
post reply
|
|
John Byrne wrote:
Incidentally, the current rules at Marvel hold that the first people to write and draw a character are the “creators” of that character. |
|
|
Which begs the question: What is there to be gained by such a policy/rule?
It has some intriguing implications for characters such as Adam Warlock...
Edited by Rob Ocelot on 29 July 2019 at 5:01am
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 132320
|
Posted: 29 July 2019 at 5:34am | IP Logged | 8
|
post reply
|
|
If nothing else it cleans up the paperwork. So many characters result from a string of extrapolation based on an existing concept. Adam Warlock is a prime example. Stan and Jack created the original concept, Roy Thomas added a name, Gil Kane a costume. Only the first action is true creation. (Sometime I think people get confused about the difference between “creation” and “creative”.)
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Robert Bradley Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 September 2006 Location: United States Posts: 4830
|
Posted: 29 July 2019 at 7:54am | IP Logged | 9
|
post reply
|
|
It can be even more convoluted when a supporting character (such as Carol Danvers) later is re-imagined as a super-hero.
Carol Danvers was created by Roy Thomas and Dean Colan. She was later made into Ms. Marvel by Gerry Conway and John Buscema. But her costume was designed by John Romita closely-based on a costume designed by Gil Kane. She then received several costume and name (Binary, Warbird, Captain Marvel) changes to the point where all she really has in common with the original character is her civilian identity..
So is she the same character that Thomas and Colan created? Is the creation process more in come cases than just coming up with the original name and design? In some cases I would say yes.
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
|
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 132320
|
Posted: 29 July 2019 at 8:10am | IP Logged | 10
|
post reply
|
|
And I would say no. Everything that happened to Carol Danvers was extrapolation. Unless there is a clearly defined break in her continuity, she’s the same character created by Thomas and Colan.
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Andrew Cate Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 February 2019 Location: United States Posts: 158
|
Posted: 29 July 2019 at 3:36pm | IP Logged | 11
|
post reply
|
|
The BIG question is who plays a young JB if the movie features scenes of the Marvel bullpen from the 70's on.
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|
Rob Ocelot Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 December 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1231
|
Posted: 30 July 2019 at 5:24am | IP Logged | 12
|
post reply
|
|
John Byrne wrote:
If nothing else it cleans up the paperwork. So many characters result from a string of extrapolation based on an existing concept. Adam Warlock is a prime example. Stan and Jack created the original concept, Roy Thomas added a name, Gil Kane a costume. Only the first action is true creation. |
|
|
I'm 100% with you on that.
My original thought was that if you took away all of the stuff added by Thomas, Starlin and others do you still have Adam Warlock? It's easy to do this for a character like Spider-man or Thor since those essential elements (character traits, motivations, costume) were there from day one at the point of creation (or at least the first published manefestation of the character).
With HIM/Adam Warlock it's less cut and dry -- but I went back and read the original Lee and Kirby material and lo and behold... he's not just a guy in a coccoon. All of the core Warlock things are present -- including being the apex of human evolution, golden skin/hair and mental powers. He's portrayed more as monster-of-the-month rather than a hero but I don't think that really matters. I hadn't read FF #66/67 in years (decades?) and always assumed these appearances were tacked on when the character became popular in the 90s in much the same way Web of Spiderman 18 briefly became the 'first appearance' of Venom. It's clearly not the case though, Warlock is through and through a Kirby/Lee creation.
|
Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
|