| Author |
|
Andrew Hilsmann
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 844
|
| Posted: 10 June 2005 at 9:38pm | IP Logged | 1
|
|
|
John Byrne wrote:
| No one else has mentioned the two pages with the George Perez storytelling (Inserts? Insets? Inline graphics? Don't know what term to use) -- the page where Repulse "armors up" and Superman's moment of truth with Black Adam.
****
Somewhere, the shade of Will Eisner is astonished to learn he was swiping George Perez. |
|
|
Well alrighty then. Again, I liked it, but Perez is definitely a man who likes those thick black borders around those smaller panels. (I recently re-read the first 9 issues of his Wonder Woman reboot and was struck by the use of Perez Simultaneity -- his extroverted paneling style that shows everything happening all at once -- which is so different from any of his other contemporaries at the time.) That old coot Will Eisner was pretty good too. But hey, I noticed didn't I?
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Richard Siegel
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 January 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 868
|
| Posted: 11 June 2005 at 7:34am | IP Logged | 2
|
|
|
Inking mushily is one thing.
Redrawing entirely is another. Which is why aafter I did 4 pages of pencils for an unamed Marvel book years ago and saw the inks...never again. Id rather ink my own stuff ...badly.
Then again Ive read about Vince Colleta erasing lotsa Kirby detail into limbo.
Ugh
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Joe Hollon
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 13680
|
| Posted: 11 June 2005 at 7:49am | IP Logged | 3
|
|
|
Holy crap! The comparison Ed posted above is inexcusable! JB, how can he get away with that? Does an editor have to approve that? I mean, c'mon they're paying you to do the pencils...Couldn't (shoudn't?) you complain about this?
Has anyone here tried inking JB's Action Comics pencils? I'd like to see that compared to what is being passed off to us as "professional".
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
John Byrne
Robot Wrangler
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 102266
|
| Posted: 11 June 2005 at 8:08am | IP Logged | 4
|
|
|
I mean, c'mon they're paying you to do the pencils.
****
I made that point myself, talking to Dan DiDio.
Seems rather a waste of DC's money to hire
any penciler and then have the inker change
things. We are "discussing" this.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
John Byrne
Robot Wrangler
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 102266
|
| Posted: 11 June 2005 at 8:11am | IP Logged | 5
|
|
|
Then again Ive read about Vince Colleta erasing lotsa Kirby detail into limbo.**** Yes, apparently Vinnie used to zip thru the books by dropping backgrounds and turning crowd scenes into silhouettes. I can't say I was ever consciously aware of this in the end result -- so I suppose it comes down to the old truism, that we the readers really have little in the way of knowing what the artist(s) intended to be on the page. With the magic of the InterNet, at lest some of us can get the "first steps" out there to be seen, and the audience can judge for itself whether the finishd product is good, bad, or neutral.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
Andrew Hilsmann
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 844
|
| Posted: 11 June 2005 at 8:16am | IP Logged | 6
|
|
|
John Byrne wrote:
I mean, c'mon they're paying you to do the pencils.
****
I made that point myself, talking to Dan DiDio.
Seems rather a waste of DC's money to hire
any penciler and then have the inker change
things. We are "discussing" this. |
|
|
So you're unhappy with Nelson's inks, JB? Is it specific instances, or overall? Nelson is certainly a change of pace from your usual stuff. He does seem to be adding backgrounds in certain panels, but I do like the end result in many cases. I thought you were happy with the end result on the first issue, for the most part.
Edited by Andrew Hilsmann on 11 June 2005 at 8:19am
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
|
| Posted: 11 June 2005 at 8:46am | IP Logged | 7
|
|
|
Here's just my speculation: the editor is asking the inker to change
JB's art to look more like the styles of other pencillers.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Bill Lukash
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1762
|
| Posted: 11 June 2005 at 9:52am | IP Logged | 8
|
|
|
I'd be sad to see Nelson go, if your speculation is correct, Joe, but I
don't think we should jump the gun. Did Nelson redraw parts of
that page? Hell yes, he (or somebody) did. I have to be
perfectly honest though, he didn't ruin it, for me, in fact, I kinda
like it...as much as what JB originally drew. I wonder if Nelson
made the call to re-draw the panel or if it was an editorial
decision? And if so, why was it made? Hell, mabye the
editor wanted Repulse to be more "sassy" and less "psychotic." I
dunno.
I've been able to convince several people to pick up Action who
normally wouldn't buy a Byrne book. They basically take one look
at the art and say something along the lines of "Wow, Byrne hasn't
looked this good in a long time." Since perception is often
reality (sadly), I don't argue. A few even noticed that Nelson is
"overdrawing" Byrne, but not as much as Ordway did.
For the record, I like Nelson and hope he stays on for a while.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
|
| Posted: 11 June 2005 at 10:01am | IP Logged | 9
|
|
|
I don't think Nelson is to blame for the wholesale instances of redrawing, such as Repulse's face.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Vinny Valenti
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 8053
|
| Posted: 11 June 2005 at 10:03am | IP Logged | 10
|
|
|
It's a strange thing about Nelson - since he didn't redraw everything,
just select panels here and there, without much rhyme or reason as to which
were redrawn and which were not. In the second issue I saw panels where
JB's faces shown through and I would have figured Nelson would redraw for
sure, the last page for instance. I'm hoping the solution is to ask him to cool
it with the redrawing of faces instead of replacing him outright.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Andy Smith
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 June 2004
Posts: 503
|
| Posted: 11 June 2005 at 10:58am | IP Logged | 11
|
|
|
Joe Hollon wrote:
Holy crap! The comparison Ed posted above
is inexcusable! JB, how can he get away with that? Does an
editor have to approve that? I mean, c'mon they're paying you to do the pencils...Couldn't (shoudn't?) you complain about this?
Has anyone here tried inking JB's Action Comics pencils? I'd
like to see that compared to what is being passed off to us as
"professional". |
|
|
If you go to the topic, inking JB's pencils ( or something like that), I posted up a Superman shot I inked from True Brit.
andy
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Dave Farabee
Byrne Robotics Member
Quit Forum
Joined: 01 September 2004
Posts: 985
|
| Posted: 11 June 2005 at 12:07pm | IP Logged | 12
|
|
|
Bill Lukash wrote:
I'd be sad to see Nelson go, if your speculation is correct, Joe, but I don't think we should jump the gun. Did Nelson redraw parts of that page? Hell yes, he (or somebody) did. I have to be perfectly honest though, he didn't ruin it, for me, in fact, I kinda like it...as much as what JB originally drew. I wonder if Nelson made the call to re-draw the panel or if it was an editorial decision? And if so, why was it made? Hell, mabye the editor wanted Repulse to be more "sassy" and less "psychotic." I dunno.
I've been able to convince several people to pick up Action who normally wouldn't buy a Byrne book. They basically take one look at the art and say something along the lines of "Wow, Byrne hasn't looked this good in a long time." Since perception is often reality (sadly), I don't argue. A few even noticed that Nelson is "overdrawing" Byrne, but not as much as Ordway did.
For the record, I like Nelson and hope he stays on for a while.
|
|
|
I agree with pretty much everything you posted.
And while I think it's too early to attribute brisk sales of ACTION to any one thing (Nelson's inks, Byrne back on Superman, Gail Simone devotees), I can say that it's indeed moving quite nicely at my store.
I'm very happy with it. Probably my favorite superhero book of the moment.
-Dave
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Topic Closed)
