I'll never understand the Holocaust deniers. It's one thing to think it was a good thing or whatever, but to say that it never happened? What about the scads of footage of the atrocities in action? How do they actually answer that?

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SER: It's very dangerous when the horrors of events tend to get diluted. This is probably even more of an issue with the Confederacy. I've been in *classes* where I was told that slavery wasn't "as bad as we thought" -- slaves were property and do you go out of your way to damage your car? Of course not, you take good care of it! Now, the Irish were probably treated far worse because they *weren't* property.

I'm a reasonably intelligent black guy in his thirties but based on what I was taught in school, I really could have believed that the Civil War had nothing to do with slavery (or that slavery was just a side issue). It wasn't until I started reading books on the subject -- on my own, outside of school -- that I saw how the slave position was distinctly the wedge issue that wind up leading to secession. It was so clear to me that it was scary to think that people claimed this wasn't the case. "States rights" and all that.

Now, the Irish were probably treated far worse because they *weren't* property.

Yeah, but they deserved it, filthy potato eaters . . . . .

I'm still surprised they allowed the Irish into Rock Ridge.

A Jewish friend was just telling me about a time he and his wife were hanging out with another couple that they had known for a couple of years, when it came out the husband of this couple belonged to the KKK.

My friend said, words to the affect of "You know we're Jewish, right?" The KKK guy said, "Yeah, but you two are okay."

"My friend said, words to the affect of "You know we're Jewish, right?" The KKK guy said, "Yeah, but you two are okay."

FEH!

what I found most troubling about the images linked above are the number of children....the Hitler Youth were massive in their number.  Don't tell me they ALL just stopped believing the hatred they were taught

"what I found most troubling about the images linked above are the number of children"

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Children often cheer the head of the state without necessarily understanding what that head of state stands for (or even knowing that a head of state does stand for something). Those pictures are disturbing in a lot of ways -- just what was Neville Chamberlain thinking?? -- not least because of the scale, but just going by what is in the pictures, the ones with the kids aren't that far removed from parades I went to as a kid to see the Queen going by (just with, like, fewer swastikas and all).

Obviously we know now that the Nazi party represented xenophobic hatred on an unparallelled nature and was responsible for attrocities on an unprecedented scale. We look at kids cheering that self-same bunch and their leader and we think, 'scary', but the kids probably had little idea what they were cheering beyond doing their bit to support their national leader like daddy told them. Kids will generally do what they're told and believe what their parents tell them. If their parents tell them 'Hitler is a great man, cheer for him', they'll do it.

I suppose it shows how dodgy all this kind of nationalistic breast-bashing is when you get kids involved who just don't know any better. If you go to a parade as a kid and wave a flag by the time you're old enough to make up your own mind it's too late.

Edited to add: I'm not in anyway trying to defend the institution of the Hitler Youth, just trying to give the benefit of the doubt to those too young to swim against the current. 

Brad, anybody near AZ is welcome! Oh and we are moving to TEXAS in 6 months!

Where?