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Topic: Healthcare Debate (was: Quesada apologizes) (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post ReplyPost New Topic
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Matthew McCallum
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Posted: 15 April 2010 at 1:49pm | IP Logged | 1  

Not all opinions are created equal. Some are ill-informed and don't consider new information or the full body of tested data available. Others harbour bias, or are based in prejudice. Still others may have been formed under social conditions, social traditions or social mores that are no longer relevant and thus the opinion may seem outdated.

Not all facts are created equal. Some facts are the result of poor scholarship or dubious reporting. Many facts are preliminary or impermanent and subject to change. For example, science has whole fields of study built upon the facts as we know them today which can be laid waste as new facts emerge.

It is possible -- perhaps even expected -- that two individuals can look at the same set of facts and draw different conclusions. But for an opinion to be valid argument, it should be immersed in the facts and constructed on more than just feelings.

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Al Cook
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Posted: 15 April 2010 at 1:50pm | IP Logged | 2  

"If someone thinks I'm a jerk thats fine, if they beat the crap out of me because they feel that way thats wrong."

Well, that's just your opinion.
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Al Cook
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Posted: 15 April 2010 at 1:54pm | IP Logged | 3  

Poor scholarship and dubious reporting; neither produces facts.
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Matthew McCallum
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Posted: 15 April 2010 at 1:59pm | IP Logged | 4  

Poor scholarship and dubious reporting; neither produces facts.

I would agree, save that in our interconnected age the bitter fruits of those labours gain currency in the marketplace as established facts before they can be disproven and countered. (There is a wide gulf between "facts" and truth.)

For example, we produce a drug study and report a finding. A later study calls into question the methodology of our initial study and produces a different finding. Our original finding was a fact until challenged by the subsequent study, and remains a fact (albeit disputed) while under challenge. Our first study may be vindicated and its findings emerge as a tested fact. Or it may be disproven entirely. Or we may have competing findings and the facts are unclear.



Edited by Matthew McCallum on 15 April 2010 at 2:14pm
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Michael Sommerville
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Posted: 15 April 2010 at 2:55pm | IP Logged | 5  

Knut, I think I agree with what you are saying about fact and opinion. I think the world would be a very quiet place if we only discussed facts. I would also say alot of conflict is based on differing opinions but so is progress. This board has many threads that are started and commented on the basis of opinion.
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Al Cook
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Posted: 15 April 2010 at 2:57pm | IP Logged | 6  

Yep.  Ain't it glorious?
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Michael Sommerville
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Posted: 15 April 2010 at 3:28pm | IP Logged | 7  

I really do enjoy it. It is really interesting to see when people who are so apposed to each other in one thread still have things they agree on in others.
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Jodi Moisan
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Posted: 15 April 2010 at 9:31pm | IP Logged | 8  

So now what are the tea baggers upset about can't be higher taxes:

For those that hate links:
Believe it or not, tea partiers, your taxes probably went down this year. Soon after Barack Obama took office, those tax-and-spend Democrats cut individuals’ federal taxes by roughly $173 billion, the AP reports, which should more than make up for any tax increases states were forced to push through to make up for mortgage crisis budget shortfalls. “The fact is, in the past year we have had more tax cuts than almost any time in our nation’s history,” said one Democratic congressman. But “people don’t realize because of the false rhetoric” from conservatives. But Republican complaints aren’t totally baseless; the Bush tax cuts will expire in January, and some tax increases were included in the health care legislation, meaning taxes will be heftier in the future.
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Mike O'Brien
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Posted: 15 April 2010 at 10:09pm | IP Logged | 9  

Be clear about the taxes, Jodi - higher, like, to what they were in the late 1990s.

The right wing corporate media tries to re-write history constantly, but I think all of us were alive and can remember the 90s - they weren't that long ago - and things were AWESOME economically in the late 90s, so...

If Obama gives us more of that, who's complainin'?? Oh, yeah. Republicans.

Why do you hate America, Republicans???

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Wayde Murray
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Posted: 16 April 2010 at 4:13am | IP Logged | 10  

It almost seems like Democrats want to be proven right, even if they have to wait too long for it to happen to give them necessary traction, and Republicans want to win the argument immediately, even if they have to be wrong to accomplish it. 

Sadly, so far the Republican method appears to be more effective. 

 

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Mike Benson
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Posted: 16 April 2010 at 5:16am | IP Logged | 11  

Those horrible 90s.  Budget surplus.  Booming economy.  Relative peace.  Yes, let's not go back to that. 

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Al Cook
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Posted: 16 April 2010 at 5:33am | IP Logged | 12  

Remember the good old days, when the only thing the Republicans tried to divide the country over was a blow job?
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