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Paul Greer Byrne Robotics Security

Joined: 18 August 2004 Posts: 14201
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Posted: 04 April 2010 at 9:56pm | IP Logged | 1
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"I just don't think that a crude drawing of Obama on that sign is racism." ******************* You are either a fool or a liar, Jeff. That "crude drawing" has been used to make black people look like they are just "buffoonish animals" for decades. Since you speak that racism can only be cured with education and time, maybe you need to spend sometime educating yourself to the subject. "But let me tell you this, the more people scream "RACIST" at every little thing imaginable, the word itself becomes less powerful. It's getting close to "the boy who cried wolf" syndrome already now." ************************* Another thing, don't you ever think you have the authority to tell me where or when I can call racism. It is a topic I am in touch with and have experienced first hand. I will not sit idly by and allow such a topic to go unchallenged. You can live your life with blinders on, but I refuse to do so.
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Brad Krawchuk Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 19 June 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 5814
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Posted: 04 April 2010 at 10:39pm | IP Logged | 2
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I just don't think that a crude drawing of Obama on that sign is racism.
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Do you think a burning cross on a front lawn is racist? A comment about watermelon and fried chicken? Someone wearing blackface? If you said yes to any of those, but no to drawing Obama as a monkey, I seriously have no idea where you get your sense of racial history from. Maybe we should draw Asian politicians with buck teeth and squinty eyes and yellow skin - that's not racist. You'd be making a lot of assumptions to say that's racist!
Either you're too ignorant to understand the context of such a picture, or the moron holding it is too ignorant. Either way, it's no excuse - once someone says it's racism and it is historically linked to racism and white superiority, you should apologize for the misunderstanding and make sure you don't do it again. Don't keep defending it!
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Jeff Gillmer Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 30 August 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1920
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Posted: 04 April 2010 at 10:40pm | IP Logged | 3
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Gee Paul, tough choices there. One extreme or the other. It couldn't possibly be something as simple as not agreeing with your assumption could it? Did I tell say to you that you couldn't do, think or say anything? No. I stated MY beliefs. You can do whatever you want to do. Unfortunately it appears that you do feel you have the authority to tell someone what they should think or feel. You know zero about me or my life outside the 1726 posts I've made here on the JBF. Let me ask you, Have you ever stood up to a co-worker when they have used deragatory language against a person of a different race or ethnic background or even physical disability? I have, on all three counts. Have you ever done the same to a family member for the same reason? I have. Have you ever voted for someone of a different race before the last Presidential election? I have. Have you dated someone different than your race, ethnic background or physical disability? I have. So you calling me a racist is just laughable.
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Mike O'Brien Byrne Robotics Member
Official JB Historian
Joined: 18 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 10927
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Posted: 04 April 2010 at 10:52pm | IP Logged | 4
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Um... Paul's wife is black, Jeff.
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Jeff Gillmer Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 30 August 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1920
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Posted: 04 April 2010 at 10:52pm | IP Logged | 5
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Ah finally, the inevitable "what about this, or this, or this" question. Honestly, I expected someone else to bring it up first Brad. When the congressman sent out the postcard of the White House with the watermellon patch in front of it, I was deeply disappointed and offended and said so at the time.
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Jeff Gillmer Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 30 August 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1920
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Posted: 04 April 2010 at 10:54pm | IP Logged | 6
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Is Paul black? White? Purple with orange polka dots? I don't know, that's why I phrased it "different".
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Mike O'Brien Byrne Robotics Member
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Joined: 18 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 10927
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Posted: 04 April 2010 at 11:00pm | IP Logged | 7
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Paul is white. He's posted pics of he and his wife here.I feel kind of lame speaking for Paul, nor do I expect you to have an encylopedic knowledge of everyone on here, but I wanted to kind of put some water on this before it got too out of hand. Suffice it to say, I thinl Paul has a pretty good grasp on these issues. As far as I'm concerned, i'd say you don"t need to appologise or back down, but i'd certainly stop defending you point, if I were you. Well. If I were you I would appologise and back down, but at the minimu, i'd know when to cut and run.
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Brad Krawchuk Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 19 June 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 5814
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Posted: 04 April 2010 at 11:01pm | IP Logged | 8
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Ah finally, the inevitable "what about this, or this, or this" question. Honestly, I expected someone else to bring it up first Brad. When the congressman sent out the postcard of the White House with the watermellon patch in front of it, I was deeply disappointed and offended and said so at the time. --- But Jeff - black people = monkeys is as popular (is that really the right word here? Common?) a racial epithet as black people liking watermelon. I've seen dozens of political cartoons all through the Jim Crowe days right up until the Civil Rights movement that have depicted black people as monkeys. It's a VERY common racially offensive term. A picture of Obama as a monkey is clearly racially motivated, unless the person holding the sign is an entirely different form of stupid than just plain racist.
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Mike O'Brien Byrne Robotics Member
Official JB Historian
Joined: 18 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 10927
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Posted: 04 April 2010 at 11:09pm | IP Logged | 9
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Some people take a view of race relations - people like, say Dr Rev Martin Luther King Jr and John Byrne - where we long for the day when race doesn't matter. That we will reach a stage in human development where, white, black, asian, whatever; we're all People.Sadly some people take that too far too fast and wipe out all memory of the hate before the wounds have healed, perhaps thinking that they can wish away the injuries of racial oppression past... just in time to call Obama a watermellon eating monkey. These people, by the way, are assholes.
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Brad Krawchuk Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 19 June 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 5814
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Posted: 04 April 2010 at 11:53pm | IP Logged | 10
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Some people take a view of race relations - people like, say Dr Rev Martin Luther King Jr and John Byrne - where we long for the day when race doesn't matter. That we will reach a stage in human development where, white, black, asian, whatever; we're all People.
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This would be my idea of utopia. As you say though, it doesn't mean we have to start ignoring the wrongs of the past. The fact that there are so very many people today that are totally ignorant and/or pathologically dismissive of racial inequalities and the historical foundations of them just makes me sick. It's frustrating - not just with this issue, but where I am especially dealing with First Nations peoples and their rights - to have conversations with people who deal with the whole issue by saying "So? We're all equal now, what does it matter what happened then?"
No, we're not all equal yet. Yes, it does matter what happened then. No, I don't feel sorry for white heterosexual guys (I am one) when they claim reverse racism or whatever. 99% of civilization has been about white hetero guys killing everything that wasn't us. You wanna bitch to me about not getting a job so that a company can put a visible minority on their payroll? Fuck off, you know?
One of my favourite lines about such issues is from West Wing, when Admiral Fitzwallace (played by John Amos) is asked if he thinks gays in the military would disrupt the cohesion of the units they join. He says of course it would - just as it did when black soldiers were first put into white units. After a while, the kinks get worked out, and everyone just goes back to being soldiers.
It takes balls to take that first step, though. To say "this is going to be rough, but it's the right thing to do!" and then to do it. This whole Obama thing is like that - the Healthcare Bill may not be perfect, but goddamn it's a step in the right direction for the first time in a very long time!
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Jodi Moisan Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 19 February 2008 Location: United States Posts: 6808
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Posted: 05 April 2010 at 12:50am | IP Logged | 11
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Here is something I just haven't seen yet, all those elderly tea baggers burning their medicare cards and refusing it, I mean if they are truly against socialized medicine, refuse it. Or social security, they have paid into it, but they are getting way more back. Again if the govt. is so evil and controlling, where is the refusal of services?
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Victor Rodgers Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 26 December 2004 Posts: 3508
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Posted: 05 April 2010 at 1:01am | IP Logged | 12
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reverse racism
****** Is it wearing racism's costume with the colors reversed.
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