| Author |
|
Eric Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 27 October 2013
Location: United States
Posts: 2580
|
| Posted: 24 August 2026 at 5:51am | IP Logged | 1
|
post reply
|
|
On the Roger McKenzie thread, JB mentions Frank Miller telling him about problems working with McKenzie. That makes sense--Miller was a new artist and McKenzie was already established on the title--I've wondered since I was a kid if the writer was at all "pushed out" by the up-and-coming artist who wanted to write (or by the editor who saw Miller's potential).
This (and JB's Claremont stories) makes me wonder about all the other "co-plotters' teams (mostly from 1980's Marvel) I enjoyed!
I always assumed these co-plotter teams were friendly endeavors, perhaps even pushed by the writer & artist. David Michelinie and Bob Layton always certainly seemed like friends going back to DC days, two (or three) stints on IRON MAN and some other stories. Are they the exception or the rule?
Any other insight you can share in this, JB? And then, after JB, anybody else?
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 136931
|
| Posted: 24 August 2026 at 2:34pm | IP Logged | 2
|
post reply
|
|
It was a different scenario in every case. For example, I found working with Roger Stern to be a very different experience (more truly a collaboration) than working with Chris Claremont.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Eric White
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 October 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 1091
|
| Posted: 24 August 2026 at 4:26pm | IP Logged | 3
|
post reply
|
|
I always wondered about Roger McKenzie because it seemed like there was some talk about him being a tad difficult at times.
I was surprised to find out he came up with the idea of Cap running for President and being elected. I thought you and Roger Stern's story was much better than Roger's plan of devoting 4 years to telling stories about President Steve Rogers.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Eric Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 27 October 2013
Location: United States
Posts: 2580
|
| Posted: 24 August 2026 at 11:29pm | IP Logged | 4
|
post reply
|
|
I seem to like the co-plotters better than those individuals doing solo work.
Writer David Michelinie and inker Bob Layton co-plotted IRON MAN, and while I liked their individual work--Layton's writing was fun, while Michelinie's seemed more serious--their work together had just the right mix.
I really liked NEW TEEN TITANS when it was co-plotted by writer Marv Wolfman and penciler George Perez, better than when they both wrote solo.
John Byrne is great on his own and Chris Claremont is a good writer, but, looking back, I find that I did like Claremont better when he and Byrne were listed as co-plotters.
Any other favorite co-plotter teams out there?
Edited by Eric Jansen on 25 August 2026 at 6:23am
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
David Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Posts: 3237
|
| Posted: 25 August 2026 at 5:32am | IP Logged | 5
|
post reply
|
|
I can't find it now, but I recall an interview with Neal Adams where he characterized his Avengers run as him continuing Sal Buscema's story. It made me wonder how many stories created in the classic Marvel Style were effectively co-plotted by the artists, if not plotted almost entirely.
JB, across your experience, how were your contributions to a story you were credited as penciler different from stories where you received a co-plotter or plotter credit?
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Vinny Valenti
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 8667
|
| Posted: 25 August 2026 at 1:24pm | IP Logged | 6
|
post reply
|
|
Neal Adams really should have gotten co-plotter credit for the Thomas X-MEN run, IMO.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 136931
|
| Posted: 25 August 2026 at 1:35pm | IP Logged | 7
|
post reply
|
|
Yes, I remain convinced that big Magneto reveal came from Neal. Roy’s script gives no indication the artificial evolved humans working for Magneto knew who he was, yet plainly they should.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Vinny Valenti
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 8667
|
| Posted: 25 August 2026 at 3:12pm | IP Logged | 8
|
post reply
|
|
If you see Neal's written work, it can be quite wild, and borderline crazy (see BATMAN ODYSSEY). I see bits of that in the X-MEN run, just tempered by Thomas. (The Magneto reveal, The Living Pharoah becoming the giant Living Monolith right in his intro issue, a man bitten by a mutant Pterodactyl and becoming an energy vampire, etc). The tone completely shifts from the Thomas/Roth issues immediately preceding it, and not just visually.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Brandon Carter
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 2404
|
| Posted: 25 August 2026 at 3:12pm | IP Logged | 9
|
post reply
|
|
Neal did a panel at a convention in New Orleans about 13-14 years ago. I asked about this and he confirmed that it was his idea! Of course, even though I haven't heard Roy address this aspect specifically, in recent years, Roy has disputed some other things Neal has said about their collaborations. After nearly 60 years, it may be hard to say whose memories are more reliable.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Greg McPhee
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 August 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 5207
|
| Posted: 25 August 2026 at 3:19pm | IP Logged | 10
|
post reply
|
|
Might be a bit more expansive, but...
The Superman teams from 1988 - 1996 under the guidance of Mike Carlin worked well together on what really was an extended narrative. With Ordway, Stern and Jurgens doing some great stuff on their runs and having Perez, Gammill, McLeod, Breeding, Rubinstein, Simonson, Bogdanove, Guice and Rodier along didn't hurt either.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 136931
|
| Posted: 25 August 2026 at 3:30pm | IP Logged | 11
|
post reply
|
|
Neal did a panel at a convention in New Orleans about 13-14 years ago. I asked about this and he confirmed that it was his idea! Of course, even though I haven't heard Roy address this aspect specifically, in recent years, Roy has disputed some other things Neal has said about their collaborations. ••• The first time I lofted my idea—I think it was in a TBG lettercol—Roy jumped in to say the idea was entirely his.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Brian Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 32202
|
| Posted: 25 August 2026 at 4:17pm | IP Logged | 12
|
post reply
|
|
Remember, Roy created Wolverine.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
