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Kevin Pierce Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 10 September 2004 Location: United States Posts: 2010
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Posted: 27 September 2005 at 1:55pm | IP Logged | 1
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One problem is that the industry has demanded more and more hyper-detailed art out of its artists. At one time, photo-realism like Neal Adams was the exception, not the rule, now it's practically industry standard. Not an excuse, but I don't think, with current art styles the way they are, that any mainstream book should be monthly.
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Just don't agree with that theory, there are several good artists that more than have the ability to ship a book on time. However, they are allowed to get away with turning in their work late.
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Eric Lund Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 15 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 2074
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Posted: 27 September 2005 at 2:36pm | IP Logged | 2
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I buy ULTIMATES for 1 reason and 1 reason alone....Bryan Hitch.... He leaves or stops drawing the book I stop buying it ...plain and simple....
I don't care if they get a creative team that can do 10 issues a week... I won't waste one penny on that title. I don't need a "Weekly" or even "Monthly" fix.... I want to buy good art or art that inspires me... Any company that wants to put out 5,000 titles of crap art is going to not sell me anything... A company that puts out one book a decade with Frank Frazetta's art in it gets my money everytime...
Quality not Quantity..... I would rather have one great painting in my entire lifetime than 5 million shitty ones....
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Thanos Kollias Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 19 June 2004 Location: Greece Posts: 5009
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Posted: 27 September 2005 at 2:44pm | IP Logged | 3
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But Eric, who says you have to settle for crap art?
Either Hitch has to reschedule and give us 12 issues per year or have
another great artist fill-in in case he has a personal problem.
Simple as that....
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Scott Michael Byrne Robotics Member
Membership Terminated
Joined: 16 April 2004 Posts: 550
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Posted: 27 September 2005 at 5:13pm | IP Logged | 4
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I don't know what's going on but I've been waiting for ELRIC #3, from Moorcock and Simonson, for what seems like years now.
It's an interesting discussion. I don't like late books.
You start reading something and then the "end" shows up months
later. Comics have changed so much since I was a kid. I
wonder if Kirby were alive today, doing monthly books, would they even
sell to today's audience? He could certainly get the job done on
time, and the quality never slipped. So could tons of other
professionals. Some artists can't seem to, or have no desire to,
turn in a montly title but are pretty good artists. Look at Mike
Kaluta or Charles Vess -- when was the last time they took on monthly
books? Kaluta couldn't even get THE SHADOW in on time way back
when. Vess was never on a monthly title I can remember but has
done some beautiful work on BALLADS.
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Jeff Gillmer Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 30 August 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1920
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Posted: 27 September 2005 at 5:19pm | IP Logged | 5
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Eric, that's fine. But Marvel (and all involved) should be honest and solicit the book frequency as "Whenever the hell we feel like publishing it" instead of "Monthly".
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Paul Greer Byrne Robotics Security

Joined: 18 August 2004 Posts: 14191
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Posted: 27 September 2005 at 5:39pm | IP Logged | 6
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Lateness and all I do buy the Ultimates. I buy it more for Millar's stories than the art. I like Hitch's artwork a lot (tho he could ease up on all the celebrity faces, that really detracts from the story) but when I saw Steve Dillon's work on the Ultimates annual I think his stuff works perfect for the tone of the book. I don't know if Joe Madureira will convince me to stay after Millar has gone, but if Joe M. can't take the monthly grind I vote to give the title to Dillon! I would stay on the book for sure.
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Wallace Sellars Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 01 May 2004 Location: United States Posts: 17727
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Posted: 27 September 2005 at 6:45pm | IP Logged | 7
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Alan Davis is so good that he might be able to get me to buy THE ULTIMATES on a monthly basis... I'd much rather see him working on the real Avengers or Fantastic Four again though...
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Dan Helpingstine Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 110
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Posted: 27 September 2005 at 10:54pm | IP Logged | 8
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Joe Zhang: "...are you being paid while being on paternity leave?"
i was paid the first two weeks out of my vacation time(the company i
work for seems to have a very generous paid time off accrual rate and
they wind up practically begging people to take time off) and the
remaining 4 weeks i'm being paid out of a temporary disability fund
that allows for medical, maternity, paternity and berevement leave...
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Brian Miller Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 28 July 2004 Location: United States Posts: 31541
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Posted: 28 September 2005 at 8:34am | IP Logged | 9
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John McMahon wrote:
They are treated differently because their employers believe (rightly or wrongly) that the persons in question will make them a lot of money. The notion that Billy Bugfuck and Johnny Jerkoff could wander into Marvel and do twelve issues of Ultimates a year that would make close to what 7 from an A list team does (both short and long term) is nonsense. |
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John, I have no problem agreeing with this point. My problem comes from this fact. Ultimates is solicited as a monthly title. If the talent cannot commit to producing in a manner that would coincide with a monthly release, then one of two things should happen. Either, a) the talent needs to be replaced by someone that can do the work and have it in on time, or b) the book doesn't need to be solicited and advertised as being a monthly book. If Ultimates or Superman/ Batman or Black Cat were on bi-monthly, quarterly or bi-yearly schedules, you wouldn't hear a single complaint form me. But none of them are/ were. They were all released with the full intentions of coming out on a monthly schedule. Wehn they stopped doing so, the publisher had a choice to be professional and take one of the paths I mentioned above, or not being professional and simply having late books.
What do you think would happen if Time didn't ship on the day it was supposed to? Would the editor get fired? Would anybody? What if it was 6 weeks late? Would Time-Warner simply say, oh well, we have our audience that will buy it no matter when it comes out and they will buy the mag no matter what? The know it will be that much better if it's late. I don't think so. ( And yes, I do understand that my example includes the parent company of DC Comics.)
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Thomas Mets Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 05 September 2004 Location: United States Posts: 898
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Posted: 28 September 2005 at 10:15am | IP Logged | 10
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Well, Bugfuck and Jerkoff would probably have an easier time of it if
they were allowed to rehash the old Lee/Kirby/Ditko stories as well.
"Here's the first 4 issues of Avengers - spread it out over the next
three or four years, make it widescreen, or decompress it, or whatever
the term the morons that still buy our product are calling it these
days. Hop Hop!"
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Have you ever read the Ultimates, because I'm going to have to disagree
with you on your above statement. And I think if Bugfuck & Jerkoff
tried the above, they would fail. It's not easy to create new
masterpieces out of retelling old stories. There have been some
successes (The Ultimates, Daredevil: Yellow, Universal's Frankenstein
movies, Marvels, Batman: Year One, Scarface, Marlowe's Faust, Superman:
Man of Steel) and a lot of failures (Chapter One, Psycho, The Truth
About Charlie).
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Jeff Gillmer Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 30 August 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1920
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Posted: 28 September 2005 at 10:36am | IP Logged | 11
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Brian, it doesn't matter who the parent company is. If Time, or Newsweek, or US shipped weeks late, heads would roll.
In one of my broadcast copywriting classes in college, one Monday a fellow student came in and told the professor that he didn't have his writing assignment quite done and would bring it in on Wednesday. The professor just nodded his head. On Wednesday, the student came into the room and proudly presented the 2 page story. The professor took it, and promptly threw it into the trash. "Deadline was Monday, this is old news".
Granted that news article is a different beast than a work of fiction (but at the NY Times...nevermind...), deadlines still remain.
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Brian Miller Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 28 July 2004 Location: United States Posts: 31541
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Posted: 28 September 2005 at 10:46am | IP Logged | 12
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That's my point, Jeff. The deadlines are there ( presumably, these creators have deadlines. I wonder if they actually do have deadlines?) so wouldn't it be professional to actually meet the dealine?
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