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Jodi Moisan
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 February 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 6808
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 6:32am | IP Logged | 1
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How does everyone on here feel about putting into place, a program where once a person leaves high school they will get monetary credit towards a state funded college, if they are willing to do community service type work?
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William McCormick
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 February 2006
Posts: 3297
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 7:04am | IP Logged | 2
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Tell me then, where is the line between speech and hate speech?
*********
I think once you put the word n_____ into it you've crossed the line from speech to hate speech. There is a world of difference between "Kill Bush" and "Kill Obama" and "Kill The N_____".
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Craig Markley
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3967
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 7:20am | IP Logged | 3
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Cracker, PLEASE!!
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Scott Richards
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 September 2005
Posts: 1258
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 7:34am | IP Logged | 4
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To those of you that thinks it's OK to write what they did about Obama,
shame on you, seriously what the hell is wrong with you people! This
isn't free speech, it's hate speech.
Well if anyone was going to defend Joe, I should have guessed it would have been Alice Kravitz. Get off your high-horse, Jodi. Just because you don't like what someone says doesn't mean it isn't protected by the freedom of speech. I find it particularly amusing that you were vilifying Palin for even asking about book banning and then you do your own version of censorship right here. Priceless.
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Brad Teschner
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 June 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 3933
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 7:39am | IP Logged | 5
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What about those cubs?!
What's a Cub?
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Craig Markley
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3967
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 7:42am | IP Logged | 6
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"With malice toward none; with charity for all; with firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in; to bind up the nation’s wounds; to care for him who shall have borne the battle, and for his widow, and his orphan—to do all which may achieve and cherish a just, and a lasting peace, among ourselves, and with all nations."
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Scott Richards
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 September 2005
Posts: 1258
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 7:46am | IP Logged | 7
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How does everyone on here feel about putting into place, a program
where once a person leaves high school they will get monetary credit
towards a state funded college, if they are willing to do community
service type work?
If the amount of credit they get for each hour of service is equal to the minimum wage (after taxes), I'd have no problem with it. Since community service is supposed to be volunteer work, it most definitely shouldn't have a higher monetary value than a regular job could provide.
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Marc Baptiste
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3633
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 7:53am | IP Logged | 8
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What Jodi is saying has been rejected by the Supreme Court as a "heckler's veto" --- to simplify what that means: if you piss enough people off by saying something, you can get them punished for saying it.
I don't live in that country... yet.
Edited by Marc Baptiste on 07 November 2008 at 8:20am
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Bruce Buchanan
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 14 June 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 4797
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 7:57am | IP Logged | 9
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Writing "Kill the n______!" or "Kill Bush!" or "Kill Obama!" goes beyond the boundaries of free speech into criminal behavior.
It is communicating a threat, which absolutely is illegal. While I have the right to express my disdain for a political candidate, I do not have the right to threaten that person's well-being. And that's what the statements above do.
Having said that, it's beyond ridiculous to compare such statements, hideous as they may be, to raping a child. In my opinion, that particular crime should be a capital offense.
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Mike O'Brien
Byrne Robotics Member
Official JB Historian
Joined: 18 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 10927
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 8:20am | IP Logged | 10
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Thank you, Bruce, for pointing out that threatening to kill someone is criminal.
Back on earth: OH CRAP! You guys were right - Pelosi is out of controll already!! Her socailist agenda has been revealed! Damn! Why didn't I vote for McCain?!?
sniff... http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122600310456906045.html sniff...
Because "permanent tax cuts" is socialism, right?
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Donald Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 03 February 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 3597
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 8:22am | IP Logged | 11
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Bruce has once again read my mind...
I love the idea of a free speech wall...A place to share our thought, ideas, and opinions without fear of reprisal. I am a huge champion of free speech. But free speech comes with regulations...I can say whatever I want, but I cannot sell you a product by telling you it can cure your cancer. I can say whatever I want, but I cannot tell people that you are a thief and a liar unless I can back it up. I can say whatever I want, but I cannot call in a bomb warning to high school as a political statement.
Sharing ideas is a fine thing, if they had written "Obama will destroy our country." it would have at least shown some semblance of intelligent thought.
Threats of violence are not protected speech. If I call you out of a crowd and say "I'm gonna kick you ass." It's assault.
If I call out to a crowd of people "Kill Him" that is a threat. That is not a shared thought or belief that is being oppressed.
Even worse, they brought in "Kill the N------!", this brings in an entire race of people that could be victimized by the spill-over of hatred that is being incited.
Free speech is one of our most valued rights in this country, but it must used judiciously and with thought...
Comparing it to raping children is far out of bounds and just makes our argument sound reactionary and nuts.
Don
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John Bodin
Byrne Robotics Member
Purveyor of Rare Items
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3911
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| Posted: 07 November 2008 at 8:49am | IP Logged | 12
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Note to Mike O'Brien (or will you be changing it to "Obrien" in honor of our new Presidet-Elect? [INSERT SMILEY/WINKY EMOTICON HERE TO DENOTE HUMOR]):
I want to go on record as saying that I am glad that "the Bradley Effect" did not prove to be a factor in this election -- it gives me renewed faith in humanity and in our country in general.
I pray that you are equally right about the issue of character assassination versus less savory outcomes -- I think that if Obama can bring us a presidency that rises to the level of the Clinton administration minus the inherent philandering (Lewinski) and the controvery (Whitewater) that came along with that administration, we may indeed find ourselves better off 4 years from now.
Given that Obama is now our President-Elect, I am more than willing to buy into that level of hopefulness.
I have no love for MoveOn.org, but now it is indeed time to move on.
[EDITED TO ADD EMOTICON NOTE]
Edited by John Bodin on 07 November 2008 at 8:50am
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