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Kevin Hagerman
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 7:42am | IP Logged | 1  

Someday y'all are gonna see a real liberal and run out into traffic foaming at the mouth.
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Christopher Alan Miller
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 7:42am | IP Logged | 2  

We survived the Civil War, the Great Depression, and World War II . Bush is a minor inconvenience compared to that.
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Geoff Gibson
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:21am | IP Logged | 3  

While that may be the case for some people, it isn't for me. For me, the
key word is "illegal" as in "break the law". I have no problems with
immigration of any one through the proper channels. I have zero tolerance
for illegals though, regardless of race.


I would agree if it were a just and fairly administered law. But it is not. I am
not opposed -- per se -- to some form of penalty, in the form of a fine or
some such pecuniary penalty but deportation is both unrealistic and unfair.
We are a nation of immigrants -- when we forget that we lose our soul.
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Kevin Hagerman
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:24am | IP Logged | 4  

The immigration laws are a mess.  So are the drug laws.  But until they are reformed, they must be implemented.  Seeing the implications of implementation can be a key to reform.
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Geoff Gibson
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:25am | IP Logged | 5  

Considering who said that, I have to assume he meant it ironically.

Bingo.

And Kevin -- is that all you took from my comments? Who cares if someone
thinks he threw her under the bus or not if they embrace the message?
Forest for the trees, man. Forrest for the trees.
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Geoff Gibson
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:28am | IP Logged | 6  

The immigration laws are a mess. So are the drug laws. But until they are
reformed, they must be implemented. Seeing the implications of
implementation can be a key to reform.


I find that unacceptable because of the human toll on a great many good
people who came here, like my great-grandfather, to make a better lives for
themselves and their children. Implementation of bad laws is not justice. It
is justice perverted. Fix the law.
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Kevin Hagerman
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:29am | IP Logged | 7  

Because if someone thinks he threw her under the bus, it speaks volumes to his comprehension.  Or it reveals him to be a multimillionaire TV journalist.  Both are damning states to be in.
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Kevin Hagerman
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:30am | IP Logged | 8  

Implementation of bad laws is not justice. It is justice perverted. Fix the law.

-------------------------------

No argument from me.  But no one fixes the law.  We just dance around it.

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Geoff Gibson
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:39am | IP Logged | 9  

Because if someone thinks he threw her under the bus, it speaks
volumes to his comprehension. Or it reveals him to be a multimillionaire
TV journalist. Both are damning states to be in.


Again I disagree. My cousin thinks he threw her under the bus -- we
argued about this shortly after the speech -- and his position (which I
think is fair) is the Obama referenced a private conversation with his
grandmother -- a communication from Grandmother to grandson -- to
explain some basis for Wright's public statements. By so doing he was
exposing his grandmother's private comments to the public. How would
you feel if something you said in private to someone -- which was an
honest moment that could paint you in an unflattering light -- was
subsequently broadcast for the world to hear to defend someone who
made very public statements. Now I don't think he intended to portray
grandma that way, or to hurt her which is why I don't think he "threw her
under the bus," but if he did it to me I would be pissed.
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Kevin Hagerman
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 8:47am | IP Logged | 10  

Taking that into consideration - if his grandmother takes offense, then I will give ground.

--------------------------------

How would you feel if something you said in private to someone -- which was an honest moment that could paint you in an unflattering light -- was
subsequently broadcast for the world to hear to defend someone who
made very public statements.

------------------------------------------------------------ --

If the unflattering light was in the spirit of what I said (i.e., not out of context) then I probably wouldn't be fazed.  I've said plenty of stuff that has bitten me in the past, although nothing on a national scale.*

 

 

*although I am kind of a big deal down at the cracker factory

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Mike O'Brien
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 10:56am | IP Logged | 11  

You know, all things considered - you have to factor that Obama and his grandmother are very close - you get that from his autobiography (a must-read, by the way - Dreams From my Father) - so when I heard the speach - which detailed similar thoiughts involving his grandmother that he expressed in the book - I didn't feel like he exposed some secret - I felt that he used an example, that he had used before, to stress that we're all human.

The point of his words wasn't "My old white bitch granny is a racist!" - it was that there is a reason people feel the deep rooted feelings they do - logic be damned - and we're all subject to these feelings.  Even at home in the Obama family.

I kind of feel this phrase is over-used to the point of rendering it meaningless, but... I'll trot it out once again:  I think people are going out of thier way to miss the point on that one.

Or, as I heard on the radio the other day - (from the right wing, and they were using this as a point against Obama) - he's talking too intellegently.  Maybe people aren't missing the point on purpose - maybe the over-all level of intellegence and comprehension really is that bad.  I don't know.  I can't read the minds of the general public.  I don't know if they really don't get it, or if they're just not getting it on purpose.

Either way - it gives you pause.

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Mike O'Brien
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Posted: 22 May 2008 at 10:58am | IP Logged | 12  

Bush is a minor inconvenience

Wassa matter, you not a patriot or something?  You part of the blame-America-first crowd?!  Traitor!

Thank you, thank you ladies and gentlemen - that was my Sean Hannity impression.

Seriously, though, Christopher - I agree with every word you said - EVERY word - not just the part I took out of context to mock Hannity.  

Thanks in advance for letting me use your words to make an example.

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