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Al Cook Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 21 December 2004 Posts: 12734
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 6:56am | IP Logged | 1
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In public schools bullying gets a expulsion. Calling another kid a name will
get you a suspension.
But in this Christian school hanging a black man in effigy - a hate crime, in
other words - is OK by you Scott?
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Donald Miller Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 03 February 2005 Location: United States Posts: 3597
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 6:56am | IP Logged | 2
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Hanging a non-descript black man would have been bad enough, to hang an effigy of someone is tatamount to a death threat. Do you really believe that students who promote the death of other people should still be attending that school...
This passes beyond free speech into visual terrorism.
Don
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Bruce Buchanan Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 14 June 2006 Location: United States Posts: 4797
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 6:59am | IP Logged | 3
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And in defense of the university, it sounds like they are taking this incident seriously. The students were punished and campus officials reacted swiftly.
I'm not familiar with this school, but I'll bet these actions don't reflect the views of the vast majority of students and employees there. They certainly don't reflect the views of the vast majority of Christians (of which Barack Obama is one.)
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Al Cook Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 21 December 2004 Posts: 12734
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 7:04am | IP Logged | 4
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QUOTE:
I'll bet these actions don't reflect the views of the vast majority of
students and employees there. They certainly don't reflect the views of the
vast majority of Christians (of which Barack Obama is one.) |
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Excellent points, Bruce.
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Donald Miller Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 03 February 2005 Location: United States Posts: 3597
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 7:19am | IP Logged | 5
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According to the article the FBI is investigating as well, there is every possibility that this will be treated as a real crime and the students may not be able to attend whether they would have been allowed or not.
Don
As an aside, I think I should state for clarity that I prefer to believe that these students were trying (however poorly) to make a political statement and not a racial one. I base this on the note...I think they were trying to ridicule him not threaten him or incite any race issues...it was fishing line and not rope or a noose...that may be why the students haven't been expelled. my first thought when reading the article was that gut reaction of hate crime and death threat as well....I reread it and took note of how careful the reporters chose their words...
a cardboard cutout became an effigy, the describe it as hung in effigy and then explain that it was hung by fishing line....no not the same...
I want a picture.
Don
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Geoff Gibson Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 21 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 5744
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 7:21am | IP Logged | 6
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Wow. What to say? How anyone could defend that act as free speech boggles my mind. To begin with free speech (or expression) is not absolute right. Speech intened to incite violence, for example, is not tolerated. Defamation and libel are still torts. But lets take it out of the constitutional context. Based on the article (or at least my read of it) this act happened on school grounds, meaning that even if one were to make a First Amendment argument it would likely fail. The school has the right to restrict the kinds of speech spoken on its private grounds. Any citizen (or entity) can restrict the speech on their own property. Its public property or public areas where the right "attaches." If the school doesn't want to tolerate such displays it within their rights to do so.
For the record: In my opinion, the school did not go far enough. I would have argued for expulsion. These assholes should have to explain what they did on every job application they make out for the rest of their lives. In every interview they get, they should have to explain why they were expelled. Just my two cents, though.
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Tom French Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 07 January 2005 Location: United States Posts: 4154
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 7:31am | IP Logged | 7
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At my school, if students perpetrated this crime -- err, I mean, made this "statement" -- they would have been quickly expelled. The connotation of the message carries far too much weight to be ignored.
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Brian Talley Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 5123
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 7:58am | IP Logged | 8
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Obama will be here in Newport News speaking on Saturday. It's not in a great part of town, but the police presence should be strong, so I just might go give a listen.
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Geoff Gibson Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 21 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 5744
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 8:07am | IP Logged | 9
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Obama will be here in Newport News speaking on Saturday. It's not in a great part of town, but the police presence should be strong, so I just might go give a listen.
Brian:
If you go -- do not wear the Kilt.
Edited by Geoff Gibson on 02 October 2008 at 8:07am
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Tom French Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 07 January 2005 Location: United States Posts: 4154
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 8:09am | IP Logged | 10
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Sound advice.
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Brian Talley Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 5123
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 8:09am | IP Logged | 11
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Brian:
If you go -- do not wear the Kilt.
You would kill for legs like that.
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Al Cook Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 21 December 2004 Posts: 12734
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| Posted: 02 October 2008 at 8:32am | IP Logged | 12
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Jealousy does not become them, does it, Brian? Some men were just born to
wear kilts...
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