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Bruce Buchanan
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 14 June 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 4797
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 8:20pm | IP Logged | 1
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Squadron Supreme was a great series and I enjoyed it tremendously. It's definitely underrated. But I don't think it deserves the same level of praise as Watchmen . The storytelling techniques Moore and Gibbons employed there were groundbreaking in comics - it's the Ulysses or The Sound and the Fury of comic books.
But that doesn't mean some people won't like Squadron Supreme better, and that's fine. I'm glad we don't have to pick, as I have thoroughly enjoyed reading and re-reading both.
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Thom Price
Byrne Robotics Member
L’Homme Diabolique
Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 7593
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 8:32pm | IP Logged | 2
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I've never read Watchmen, so I obviously can't make a comparison. However, Squandron Supreme, while a very enjoyable book, is a long ways off from being 'great' in my opinion. The artwork, while certainly not terrible, falls on the low end of medioce. The story is a lot of fun but, considering the topics touched upon, feels rather light and breezy. Kingdom Come, for whatever its flaws, handles many of the same themes and ideas but with far greater power.
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Dwayne Gassmann
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 September 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 3448
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 8:42pm | IP Logged | 3
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I never read that Squadron Supreme series, reading this thread makes me want to.
While the Watchmen was pretty good when I initially read it, all the hype it gets makes me
dislike it more and more. I have never been greatly impressed with most of the Alan Moore
work that I have read.
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Bill Catellier
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 September 2007
Location: United States
Posts: 3225
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 8:46pm | IP Logged | 4
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I preferred Squadron Supreme to Watchman. I read SS when it came out, Watchman around 5-6 years later. As to the topic question, I think Watchman is just the automatic response when books of this type come up.
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George Lee
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 24 October 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 107
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 8:56pm | IP Logged | 5
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I read Watchman for the first time about a year ago (I'm pushing 40). I
was forced by a friend who swore by it. Watchmen to her is what JB's
Alpha Flight or FF is to me.
I couldn't make it past issue #3 before I gave it back. It was just a hard
read. Pace was really slow. Lot's of talking heads.
The art wasn't any better. Not my cup of tea. I'm able to appreciate many
styles of art, from JB being my all-time fave to Walt Simonson to JR jr to
Bernie Wrightson to John Buscema to Gil Kane to Alex Ross and so on.
Fans of Watchmen rave about both the writing and the art. A big yawn
and eyesore for me.
Much prefer the Squadron, even though I haven't read/looked at it in
years. Not saying the art was my cup of tea either, but the writing/story
was more enjoyable.
Edited by George Lee on 13 March 2009 at 8:58pm
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Steven Myers
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 10 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5628
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 9:13pm | IP Logged | 6
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I liked Squadron better than Watchmen.
I liked V for Vendetta better than Watchmen.
I like Vanilla better that Chocolate.
But sometimes "better" doesn't equal "popular". It's like me arguing that Field of Dreams is a better movie than Titanic. I still have to admit Titanic had a bigger impact.
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John Popa
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 March 2008
Posts: 4380
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 9:17pm | IP Logged | 7
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I always found Squadron a bit simplistic given the potential reach of its ideas. As much as it began to hint at what creators could do with super heroes if they pushed them in new directions, it still felt like a very vanilla, mid-level super hero comic to me.
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Paul Greer
Byrne Robotics Security
Joined: 18 August 2004
Posts: 14188
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 9:19pm | IP Logged | 8
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I know art is subjective, but Dave Gibbons is fantastic. He doesn't get enough credit in the success of Watchmen. I challenge anyone who disagrees to a thumb wrestling match. I'm talking to you, George Lee. :)
I really dig the Squadron Supreme mini-series. It doesn't get the accolades it should. I honestly have no idea why it doesn't.
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Mark Haslett
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6128
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 9:40pm | IP Logged | 9
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Paul:Please don't
anyone post something to the affect of "prove to me why one is better than
the other" just read them and make up your own mind. Next someone will
want proof of why vanilla is better than chocolate.
***
One might wonder why reading posts that tell other people what to do is
preferable.
BTW: Vanilla is clearly better than chocolate because it is more versatile.
QED.
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Paul Kimball
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 September 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 2169
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 9:45pm | IP Logged | 10
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Vanilla is better, beyond question and I can prove it because lots of people
agree.
It was a suggestion, not a command.
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Anthony Frail
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 09 October 2007
Posts: 960
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 10:10pm | IP Logged | 11
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I read both long, long after they came out and Squadron Supreme just doesn't hold up very well.
The dialogue is really bad and ackward, the art is fairly and uninspired, and the characters weren't well-designed or particularly cool.
However, the concept and plot were pretty damn cool. In fact, I could see how someone might argue that the plot is better than Watchmen's.
The difference, to me, is in the execution. Alan Moore writes more believable dialogue, more believable characters and can structure a story in a
more interesting way than Mark Gruenwald can.
And when you're working with an incredible talent like Dave Gibbons, it elevates your work even further.
And at the end of the day, it just seems more people like Watchmen than Squadron Supreme. I've read both and given away my copy of SS. I've
read it twice and neither time was it particularly satisfying.
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 13 March 2009 at 10:26pm | IP Logged | 12
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If SS was drawn by Dave Gibbons, maybe.
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Topic Closed)
