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James Woodcock
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Posted: 26 June 2022 at 8:51pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Granted it may have been changed, but the versions of the bible I use do
not say thou shall not kill - that’s the King James, which has all sorts of bad
translations.Most say some form of ‘do not commit murder”



Edit - just seen JB’s reply after I posted

Edited by James Woodcock on 26 June 2022 at 8:52pm
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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 26 June 2022 at 10:42pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

The commandment in Hebrew is “Lo tirtzach”, which is more accurately translated to murder. Given all the capital punishments prescribed in Exodus, Leviticus, and Deuteronomy, the Bible doesn’t have any compunctions against killing in general. 

That said, I agree with the spirit of JB’s comment. How the Bible is translated into other languages from the original Hebrew and Greek can be used and is used to push the agendas of the translators. Never mind that they are a bunch of often contradicting stories written mostly over 2000 years ago in a specific region for and by people with an entirely different framework of the world. 
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Byron Graham
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Posted: 27 June 2022 at 12:47am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

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Brian Miller
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Posted: 27 June 2022 at 1:59am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Exactly Byron. (And Sam)
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Trevor Smith
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Posted: 27 June 2022 at 10:19am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

"Uncle Clarence". DAMN, Sam!!
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Scott Wagahoff
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Posted: 27 June 2022 at 2:56pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

Past time to label Christianity as big a threat as white nationalism.
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Michael Penn
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Posted: 27 June 2022 at 3:13pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

>> Past time to label Christianity as big a threat as white nationalism. <<

Much the same phenomenon...

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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 27 June 2022 at 3:51pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

The Evangelical anti-abortion movement was a response to losing the battle for desegregation. So yeah, with respect to White Evangelicals, it’s the same thing. 




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John Wickett
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Posted: 27 June 2022 at 4:24pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

Interesting article Michael Penn.  

Early on, this paragraph jumped out at me:

"When white Americans take our surveys and answer questions about whether the United States is a Christian nation or we don’t need a separation of church and state or we should advocate Christian values in the government, for them..."

I wish there was more context.  I'd be very curious to know:
  • For the respondents, what does it mean to be a "Christian nation?"
  • What does "separation of church and state" mean?
  • What does "church" mean in the context of separation of church and state?
  • When advocating for Christian values in government, are you advocating for a theocracy, or just supporting political candidates who share your values?
I think people (including Christians) have very different understandings about what these terms mean, so an affirmative answer to some of the questions in their survey could mean lots of different things, and I wonder how well the authors took this into account.  

I'm not trying to debunk their thesis.  Its clear the white Christian nationalist ideology is real, and that it composes a segment of conservative voters.

I'm just curious how people think about these issues.


Edited by John Wickett on 27 June 2022 at 4:24pm
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Rebecca Jansen
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Posted: 27 June 2022 at 4:51pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

All the 'righteous' and the simple will ever make out of any of this is that there will be a bunch of insane women in the streets for awhile screaming about a right to kill their babies, and thus a guaranteed trip to damnation. Maybe the nuance that if a penny of their tax is involved they might go to the bad place for eternity also?
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Jason Czeskleba
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Posted: 27 June 2022 at 7:06pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

Well, the Supreme Taliban of the US has handed down another religiously-biased decision, this one significantly undoing the separation between church and state. The US is pretty much a theocracy now, ruled by a cadre of six Christian activists/extremists. 
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James Johnson
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Posted: 27 June 2022 at 8:46pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Byron (and Sam),

Uncle Clarence would be "grandfathered" in. His marriage to the looney lady would be safe.

I've said once and it bears repeating:

This country is in for some crazy shit in the next 29 months.
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