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Topic: Has the internet ruined comics? (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post ReplyPost New Topic
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John Byrne
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Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: 11 May 2005
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 8:46am | IP Logged | 1  

As far as spoiling comics go, catalogues from Mile High and other such companies kind of did that before the Internet did.

****

Well, then, push it back another notch. The Direct Sales Market, with their insistance on knowing story content three months in advace, helped ruin comics.

The "Will It Be Worth Anything" mentality of the speculator/dealer crowd, who buy/order comics not for the simple pleasures of reading them, but as an "investment".

And let us remind the world -- the only way you will ever make money "investing" in comics is if you can find buyers dumber than you are.*



*Just the other day I was chatting with a friend who related this sad tale: He was visiting relatives, and one woman told him, knowing his interest in comics, that he son had a huge collection, all carefully stored away. She proudly announced that he had many copies of the "Death of Superman" still in the bags in which they were released. She asked my friend what he thought these collector's items would be worth today. "Slightly less than what your son paid for them," was his reply.

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Clint Adams
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 8:53am | IP Logged | 2  

Give em away.  Thats what I do.  A cpl of years ago my "local" (if you can call 60 miles away local) comic shop went out of business.  I bought the owners private stash, which equated to about 30 longboxes of comics.  LOTS of the 4 different Superman issues.  And by lots, I mean unopened Diamond boxes full of multiple issues.  My wife teaches reading, so we give the comic books to reluctant readers.  i know they are 10 years old, but the kids enjoy them anyway.

The Will it be worth anything mentality is progressed on the internet by sites that list values of comicbooks.  You no longer have to wait until the big Overstreet guide comes out, its right there at your fingertips.

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Arvid Spejare
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 9:29am | IP Logged | 3  

 Kevin Brown wrote:

That's just not right. 

[sarcasm]Of course he was totally justified in doing it, too.[/sarcasm]

My searching abilities on newsgroups are virtually zero, so this second hand telling is all I could find:

 http://peterdavid.malibulist.com/archives/004062.html wrote:

There's a post from a couple of years ago about this on the alt.fan.peterdavid newsgroup. Short short version is this: Back when the PADguy was just a Marvel sales rep (instead of a writer like he is now), he was asked by a Marvel editor to drum up support for Byrne's Alpha Flight (back when it was numbered in single digits) among some comic retailers at a convention. The pages he was given to show the retailers were of the death of Guardian, though minus the word ballons the scene was interpreted as 'Heather having a bad dream after eating too many burritos before bedtime' rather than 'Guardian just bit the Big One'. Byrne comes into the room, and realized what was being passed around was a major spoiler from his run. Instead of quietly asking PAD to gather the pages from the retailers, he raised a big stink about how PAD had just spoiled the death of Guardian for him, and angrily grabs the pages from the retailers and leaves the room, leaving a bunch of retailers to discuss the spoiler that Byrne just dropped on them. Apparently Byrne's been mad about it ever since.

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Jason Fulton
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 9:33am | IP Logged | 4  

Well, that version is much more believable.

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David Miller
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 9:41am | IP Logged | 5  

Brand new rebuttal from Peter David!


 QUOTE:
Nnnnnno. A popular lie of John's, but no. Number one, it wasn't at a convention; it was at a get-together for retailers. Number two, it wasn't Guardian's death. It was an unlettered two page dream sequence in which Heather was seeing a dessicated Guardian tearing out the ground. Number three, it was part of a package of about two dozen photocopied highlights from assorted Marvel titles. Number four, the material in question was handed to me by Denny O'Neil, the book's editor when I--in my capacity as sales manager at the time--was going around collecting material to put into the package. And when I said to him, "Are you sure you want me to include this in the material?" Denny replied, "Sure, what's the harm?" Number five, retailers at the get together had no idea that the sequence actually indicated that Guardian really died. I know this because when John showed up at the get-together, he looked at the material, screamed at me at the top of his lungs, "How could you be showing this to retailers?!? It gives away the fact that Guardian dies!" and stormed out of the room, slowing only long enough to kick over a standing ashtray on his way out. At which point stunned retailers said, "Guardian DIES?," started looking at the xeroxes again, and were muttering, "I thought it was just a dream sequence..."


To think this Proustian jousting is as close to a collaboration between John Byrne and Peter David as we'll ever see. 
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Joe Zhang
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 10:08am | IP Logged | 6  

I wish Denny O'Neil can give his side of the story. 
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David Miller
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 10:22am | IP Logged | 7  

I bet one of the retailers in attendance will complain about how he was hit by the  flying ashtray.  
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Joe Zhang
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 10:26am | IP Logged | 8  

There was a retailer present who posted on this board about how JB politely excused himself from the crowd. 
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Jason Fulton
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 10:31am | IP Logged | 9  

Here's the thing - if you read JB's postings for any length of time, you'll notice that his stories / replies for this sort of thing are always the same. So JB is either a) a pathological liar or b) telling the ''true' story (as true as any story that involves more than two people can be). Twain said something along the lines of "the truth is great because it means you don't have to remember anything", right?

Plus, JB's version makes more sense because it doesn't sound like made-up bandwagon bullshit.

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John Byrne
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Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: 11 May 2005
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 10:40am | IP Logged | 10  

Well, not surprisingly, Peter David's version is nearly completely wrong.

Let's check the details. First, it was a convention. I was sitting at my table signing books and doing sketches when a fan came up to me and said "So Guardian is the one who's gonna die, huh?" I smirked my best smirk and said "That woud be telling." The guy smirked back and thrust the xeroxes at me. "No, I know it's Guardian. Peter David is handing out xeroxes."

I then sought out David and discovered that he was, indeed, doing just that, sitting behind his table and handing out xerox copies of the death scene (which did have Heather in it. He got that much right.) I exploded. I threw a fit -- but nothing else. I demanded to know what the %#$@ he was doing sabotaging a story I had been working on for more than a year. A story whose Big Reveal the Alpha office had somehow managed to keep out of the fan press. David did his best deer-in-the-headlights impression, and said it was his "job" to promote the books. "BY GIVING AWAY THE ENDINGS??" By this time I was pretty much on the verge of having a stroke. To prevent myself throttling the little sh*t I left the room, in the process stumbling and falling over a chair. Howls of laughter in the room. (This became, in earlier iterations of the story, the chair "Byrne threw at Peter David.")

When I confronted Denny, later, he professed complete ignorance of the whole thing. And, of course, he absolutely assured me there was no way in hell he would ever have authorized David handing out xeroxes of the end of the story.

It's a typical tale that has grown in the telling, but this is the true version. And, as noted above, there are witnesses who support this version.

Post Script -- I notice David leaves out of this version of his tale the bit of embroidery where he and Tom DeFalco had to come up to my room to "calm (me) down." It's a tangled web. Hard to keep track of all the strands.

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Lars Skau
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 11:06am | IP Logged | 11  

Unbelievable how some people behave, here meaning Peter David's behaviour!

JB's reaction I can understand.

 

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Joe Zhang
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Posted: 29 August 2006 at 11:09am | IP Logged | 12  

One day Shifty Pete will get his due. 
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