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Robbie Patterson
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Joined: 15 August 2004
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Posted: 06 December 2006 at 8:13pm | IP Logged | 1  

BRian.. yes, that would have been just fine :p

as long as the human torch appeared in it
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Brian Joseph
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Posted: 06 December 2006 at 9:47pm | IP Logged | 2  

Hey, we all have our kryptonite.  Or would that be that we all have our Lois Lane?
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Wallace Sellars
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Posted: 06 December 2006 at 10:13pm | IP Logged | 3  

EYKIAL looks like a Biblical name.

I liked the Don Blake character.  Didn't Marvel try going back to "a doctor becomes Thor" when the series was restarted with John Romita, Jr. as the artist? 

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Brian Joseph
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Posted: 06 December 2006 at 10:18pm | IP Logged | 4  

I thought it was more like the Demon where Thor became the man because the original died trying to save Thor.  I can't remember for sure because it didn't hold my attention for long.  A closer example may have been when Eric Masterson became Thor and retained his consciousness.

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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 06 December 2006 at 10:43pm | IP Logged | 5  

I liked the Don Blake character.  Didn't Marvel try going back to "a doctor becomes Thor" when the series was restarted with John Romita, Jr. as the artist?

---

He was given the form of Jake Olsen, a paramedic who died while Thor was fighting the Destroyer. Thor wasn't given his memories, so he kind of had to muddle through maintaining Olsen's life.
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Keith McCrackan
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Posted: 07 December 2006 at 4:36am | IP Logged | 6  

this just seems like a "lets all slag off creators that are still respected and gainfully employed on a monthly basis" kind of thread, and i will not play.
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James Revilla
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Posted: 07 December 2006 at 4:42am | IP Logged | 7  

I dont see it like that at all Keith. It is how and when this convention of story telling has been used right and wrong. It is a staple of comic book writing and I think it is a good question to ask...
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Joakim Jahlmar
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Posted: 07 December 2006 at 7:10am | IP Logged | 8  

Matt Linton wrote:
"For me, 'everything you know is a lie' depends almost entirely on how I
feel about the end result.  JB used it (if I remember correctly) to bring Iron
Fist back from the dead in Namor and I thought that was brilliant."


Having just finished those isues, I thought about the same thing, Matt.
And I'd definitely second the statement that it's brilliant in its execution.

Kevin Hagerman wrote:
"But I'd have to disagree that bringing back Iron Fist was an EYKIAL, to
the extent that Iron Fist was returned but remained Iron Fist, remained
Daniel Rand.  To REALLY cock up Iron Fist would be to reveal that he had
ALWAYS been a H'ylthri.  Oops, cat's out of the bag."

Well, while Daniel Rand indeed came back as Daniel Rand, what we knew
about his final days and demise was most definitely revealed as
"everything we knew about it was a lie". I think claiming anything else is
really splitting hairs and wanting to call it by another name just because
JB's use of it was very successful.
O and I do agree with you that the rebirth of Jean Grey was more messy
and actually ended up rewriting o so many things about not only Phoenix
but Jean Grey as well (consider the Madelyne Pryor clone etc). Messy.

Matt Reed wrote:
"I don't think it's a 50/50 could be good, could be bad sort of thing.  I
think unless an 'everything is a lie' story is told by a really talented
writer**, it doesn't work."


I agree, Matt, though I would actually say that the statement to greater or
lesser degrees applies to most narrative devices and narrative itself at
large. Sure the more complex the devices the more skilled the writer/
artist needs to be, but people without talent inevitably tells less than
stellar stories (and far too often fuck things up in a major way).

David Whitely wrote:
"I like James' 'difference between restoration and vandalism' line. I was
trying to think of my views on this and he summed it up better than I
could articulate."


I agree, David. However, while there are clearcut cases of restoration and
clearcut cases of vandalism, there are a large area of greyness
inbetween... which are of courses always infested by taste and perception.
Given that we accept the famous idea of every reader of a piece might be
a new reader of that character, etc, it ineviatbly leads to some readers
who are never familiar with the "proper" version of things in the first place
– in sense, what came last is the truth as we know it and therby proper.
Sometimes it seems that this aspect gets lost... sort of like wanting to eat
the cake and have it.
In some cases, one man's restoration can be another man's vandalism and
vice versa.

My penny.
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Sean Hollenhors
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Posted: 07 December 2006 at 7:59am | IP Logged | 9  

If it is done really, really REALLY well EYKIAL writing can be good.
Otherwise its lazy and crappy.

Edited by Sean Hollenhors on 09 December 2006 at 5:49pm
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Greg McPhee
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Posted: 07 December 2006 at 8:02am | IP Logged | 10  

One of the worst cases I saw of EYKIAL was during Bill Mantlo's tenure on Alpha Flight and in particular his treatment of James MacDonald Hudson.

Mantlo tried to enforce the idea that Mac had less than noble motives for forming AF, that he was responsible for the torture of Wolverine and his transformation with the adamantium, and he was a seriously flawed and at times evil person who used whatever was necessary to achieve his goals.

This all despite the evidence that had been shown to the contrary.

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Stanton L. Kushner
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Joined: 29 July 2006
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Posted: 07 December 2006 at 9:24am | IP Logged | 11  

i do not think it is right to make stories that are lies. they always said you should not tell lies and if these writers are making stories from lies then maybe you cant trust them anymore and that tells me the same thing. i don[t know.

Pure gold.  Keep up the good work.  I don't trust anyone who tells me a story that isn't true.  :)

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John Byrne
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Joined: 11 May 2005
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Posted: 07 December 2006 at 11:02am | IP Logged | 12  

EYKIAL

****

Isn't he one of the Eternals?
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