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Joe Hollon
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 2:47am | IP Logged | 1  

It bothers me when Flash "vibrates his molecules" allowing him to pass through solid objects.
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Michael Heide
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 3:10am | IP Logged | 2  


 QUOTE:
I think it was also the Flash (tho it may have been Quicksilver) who once managed to run up the side of a skyscraper by traveling "faster than gravity".

The Flash did this regularly. I can't think of a scene in which Quicksilver did this.


 QUOTE:
Too many times, tho, I've seen those moments -- often from people who should really know better -- where the use of the power is way out of whack. [...] Iceman making his ice so clear he becomes nearly invisible (or naked -- he's coated with ice, not made of ice!).

To be fair, they changed that during Scott Lobdell's run, when Emma Frost (yeah, I realize there's a pun) took over his body and used it for various weird effects. Ever since then, he really turns to ice.

Oh, and this is probably a great opportunity to recommend Dr. James Kakalios' "Physics of Superheroes":

Working magnetism in the Silver Age (Sadly, this clip cuts out before he gets to Magneto.)


What killed Gwen Stacy?

Silver Age physic bloopers 1 - Superman

Silver Age physic bloopers 2 - The Atom
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Thanos Kollias
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 3:35am | IP Logged | 3  

As far as Quicksilver running at the side of a building is concerned, JB is "guilty" of one such scen (FF#240), but I think JB's beef is with the "faster than gravity" part, not the act itself...

As for powers working in wrong ways I think there are quite a few examples. The worst, I think, involve Superman, especially post Man of Steel Superman. These aren't examples of downright not getting how the powers should work, but they are mistakes nonetheless.
JB had Superman state that complete darkness would eventually lead to his losing his powers, albeit in a slow way ("it would take days of complete darkness for my powers to even begin to fade" is the almost exact quote). That didn't stop DC to have him completely powerless almost in a day in a crossover event (Final Night or something).
The other is the inconsistent way of depicting his strength. After JB left, a Roger Stern scripted story had him struggle to lift and fly a simple van. OK, he was weaker than the pre MoS version, he struggled to lift a piece of earth weighing a few thousand tons, but a 5-10 ton vessel should be no strain at all!
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Jesus Garcia
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 5:38am | IP Logged | 4  

Superman's superhuman abilities were originally explained as common to all people from his planet and derived from millions of years in a demanding environment. Fair enough.

Originally, he had extraordinary strength and resilience. He could lift a car with one hand and nothing less than a bursting shell could penetrate his skin. He could outpace a train. He could leap over a tall building in a single bound.

Fair enough. There are plenty of examples in nature of creatures with amazing physical abilities superior to human beings. It's not so hard to suspend your disbelief to apply these abilities (ants lifting many times their own weight) to a human scale.

I read Philip Wylie's Gladiator three times and found the material credible. Hugo Danner and the 1938 Superman had much in common.

It's when Superman's abilities began to become "unnatural" that the problem might have started. What other Earth creatures has x-ray vision or fires heat-rays from their eyes? What other Earth creature propels itself through the air without an action-reaction mechanism? What Earth physical material is capable of standing up to laser bombardment or massive radioactivity with no damage?

Say we allow for some basic telekinetic or psionic ability, we would swim in the waters of pseudo-science where every interpretation is fair game.

Given that Superman's abilities have strayed so far into the unnatural, it's perfectly understandable that writers from within or without the medium would get him wrong. The only way to get him "right" under these circumstances is to compile a "Superman Bible" of exactly what his abilities can and cannot do.

That and not let science-ignorant people like Sam Raimi write these stories.



Edited by Jesus Garcia on 04 August 2008 at 5:40am
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John Byrne
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 5:46am | IP Logged | 5  

As I sort of suspected it might, this thread is drifting away from my original
intent. This isn't about the impracticality of super powers -- "How does
Superman fly?" -- it's about misuse of the powers as they exist -- Sue Storm
turning a zit "invisible".
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Dan Avenell
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 5:59am | IP Logged | 6  

Maybe she turned the red part of the colour spectrum invisible so that the zit looked skin tone. Though I don't recall her ever doing such a thing, if her powers are that fine-tuned, or if it would be pseudo-scientifically possible.

One that bugged me from the X-Men movies - Professor X can read minds, not control them. Made him too powerful.
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Michael Penn
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 6:06am | IP Logged | 7  

I wonder if the misuse isn't so much intentional (although still ignorant) but a by-product of wanting to do whatever seems "kewl." Superman's standing horizontal really threw me at first and I still have to blink several times when see it because it's just so atypical of how his power of flight was previously used. That doesn't mean, necessarily, that it is a misuse, of course, but isn't it likely that somebody in making the film simply thought it was a "neat" idea and just did it, without much consideration for whether his power could in fact be exercised thus? Same with Sue turning only layers of her skin invisible instead of all the way -- "Wouldn't it be just so cool if Sue just 'wiped' away a zit? Yeah! Let's do it!"

In the first Raimi Spider-Man film, he has Flash punch toward Peter, but because of Peter's new super-powered reflexes what is portrayed is Flash moving in slow-motion and, oddly, Peter moving at normal speed (comparatively). I understand there's license to give a sense of what it means to be super-powered, but the combination of Peter's powers of spider-sense and super-fast reflexes don't actually operate to make the world about him seem as if it's moving very slowly.



Edited by Michael Penn on 04 August 2008 at 6:07am
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Albert Holaso
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 6:23am | IP Logged | 8  

with respect to comicbooks, aren't EDITORS suppose to catch things like "misuse of superpowers as they exist"?
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Steve Horn
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 6:28am | IP Logged | 9  

They say at one time Superman could move a planet but I've not ever seen this.  Has anyone?
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Kevin Brown
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 6:53am | IP Logged | 10  

It bothers me when Flash "vibrates his molecules" allowing him to pass through solid objects.

*************************

Actually, that's not too farfetched considering how fast the Flash, especially Barry Allen, is.

Normal people can shake or "vibrate" their hand while pretending to be extremely nervous.  Now do that at near light speed.  Plus, also taking into consideration what the saturation of the chemicals did to his body, we don't know how much control he actually has over his molecules or bodily functions.  The "vibrating his molecules" was a very simplified explanation of it. 

The thing that bothers me the most is that the Flash should be the most "powerful" hero there is in the DCU.  A man that runs and operates at near light speed should be able to take care of any situation in less than a nanosecond.  (I'm being generous there.)  He literally sees the world "standing still".  Writers may "get" the Flash's powers, but they need to make him seem more fallable, so they "slow him down or speed him up" to fit the situation/problem.

 

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Ted Pugliese
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 6:53am | IP Logged | 11  

Didn't explain how he was able to hold his breath for about 20 minutes (speed of light), tho.

Let me use this to ask a question.  Recently, I read, somwhere, that while it appears to take light from the sun 8 minutes or so to reach the Earth from our perspective, it takes nearly no time for the photons to reach the Earth from their perspective.  That is, relativity aside, the speed of light is near instantaneous to the traveler, in this case the photons, but c to the observer.  Is this so?  Emery?

Reminds me of the time Monica flew to Jupiter.  Maybe it should have ben near instaneous from her perspective, even though x amount of time would have passed.

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Wes Wescovich
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 6:54am | IP Logged | 12  

I remember a 1970's Superman story where he was having to push the Earth back into orbit or something.  If I recall, he used his heat vision to "harden" a small patch of ground into rock and kept slamming into it with his shoulder until he acheived the desired effect. 

And then there was this:


Granted, it's the moon and he gets by with a little help from his friends.  I just wonder exactly what Batman is doing up there.  I can almost hear him yelling, "Heyah, mule! Heyah!"  Or, "All right everybody, on a count of three...."

Back to the topic:
JB, I have always thought that when Superman used his x-ray vision anything made of lead would stand out like metal under an airport scanner.  Or like a blip on a radar scanner.  This could really get crowded scanning an old building full of lead pipe plumbing.  But I have read many stories describing the exact scenario you mentioned.  The item concealed in lead was "invisible".  Certainly he would be able to see the lead itself, though, right?
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