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Jesus Garcia
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 10 April 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 2414
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 12:34pm | IP Logged | 1
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I wonder if a sufficient crital mass of Georgians are prepared to respond with guerilla war techniques.
As the never ending battles in Iraq and Afghanistan have demonstrated, superior military technology and training do not necessarily translate into short-term victory.
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Pedro Bouça
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: Portugal
Posts: 1465
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 1:22pm | IP Logged | 2
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Tchechens aren't having much luck against Russia that way, so I doubt the georgians could do better.
Anyway, I doubt that Russia will invade the whole country. Putin is WAY too smart to think that way. They'll just annex Ossetia and wait for the georgian government to get so impopular that a pro-Russia one will take its place or a bunch of other regions will secede and go to Big Daddy loking for help.
Either way, Russia wins.
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Kevin Hagerman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 April 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 17997
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 5:13pm | IP Logged | 3
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Offered without comment:
No, screw that; I am going to comment:
What the fuck? Now, I may need five minutes to find the right Georgia on the map, but it would take less than a second to know it's not the one in America!
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Brad Brickley
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 8286
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 6:01pm | IP Logged | 4
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Just as an aside, why don't we call the Republic of Georgia, Sakartvelo which is what I believe the Georgian's call themselves to avoid confusion.
I also agree that the west won't be able to do much, I'm sure the Georgians will be a major thorn in the Russian's side with this. The Chechens have been a pain for a while too. This will be more so, Georgia being a separate country.
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Ray Brady
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3740
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 6:35pm | IP Logged | 5
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Well, the headline story on CNN and MSNBC has been John Edwards' affair,
so I have to assume this little war business isn't nearly as important.
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Carmen Bernardo
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 August 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 3666
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 6:55pm | IP Logged | 6
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CNN and MSNBC would probably not care if Russia nuked Tbilisi next. Their current focus is on the Presidential campaigns, whether or not we're going to have cheap gasoline again, our soldiers getting IDE-bombed in Iraq and Afghanistan and waiting for the next Hollywood celebrity to have a nervous breakdown, drug overdose or get caught in public without their undewear. Festering ethnic conflicts in the former Soviet Union are not on their radar (unless the Russians decide to invade Alaska or northern California).
That being said, it's also a bit too early to tell what the outcome will be, since this is only the first time this is reaching us via the news services...
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Chris Durnell
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 February 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 1235
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 7:04pm | IP Logged | 7
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I've been following Russia's foreign policy, especially in regards to Ukraine and Georgia, for quite a while now. The essential thing to understand is that Russia refuses to accept the full sovereignty of countries that used to be part of the Soviet Union (technically going back to the Russian Empire under the Tsars). All of the outstanding problems within Georgia have long been manipulated and maintained by Russia.
I think that American and European diplomacy has long been incompetent with Russia. While I supported NATO expansion and even support in theory future expansion with Georgia and Ukraine, Russia does have legitimate security concerns and we've should have been willing to cut a deal with them especially because certain actions (like putting a missile defense system in Eastern Europe) were not essential and could have been used as a bargaining chip.
But none of that excuses or legitimates what Russia has done. I hope Georgia is able to withstand this. The one hopeful item is that Russia has not had an effective military in quite a while. It continues to have problems in its own Caucasus territory. Georgia could still give Russia a bloody nose.
However, further escalation would be very scary. We don't know how Russia will react or what its true goals are. Pray for Georgia.
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Michael Retour
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 27 May 2006
Posts: 932
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 7:16pm | IP Logged | 8
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Given Russia has been invaded upteem times I really doubt they are in the mood for being surrounded by NATO and they will draw a line. The West won't cross the line unless the West wants a broader war.
The mere mention/plans stationing of anti-missile defense systems was such a line.
If Russia is supposed to be our ally now why the anti-missile defense systems surrounding the perimeter of Russia?
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132315
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 7:18pm | IP Logged | 9
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Didn't Russia join NATO in 2002?
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Brad Brickley
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 8286
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 7:31pm | IP Logged | 10
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I think that Russia was just an informed member/associate state or something like that.
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Michael Retour
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 27 May 2006
Posts: 932
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 7:43pm | IP Logged | 11
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"Didn't Russia join NATO in 2002?"
No.
From NATO's site:
http://www.nato.int/issues/nato-russia/evolution.html
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Jason Ditzel
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 438
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| Posted: 08 August 2008 at 8:04pm | IP Logged | 12
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I heard this from a radio caller today:
"How did all of those tanks get passed homeland security?"
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Topic Closed)
