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Anthony Parente
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 May 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 2
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| Posted: 27 September 2014 at 9:07pm | IP Logged | 1
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I have been a lurker here for a bit and one thing I have noticed is the strong anti-gun sentiment present on this forum. So when I came across this story... Oklahoma beheading I was wondering if it was discussed here or just being ignored?Luckily the CEO was a reserve deputy and had access to a firearm or this attack would have been way worse. [Edited to clarify thread title - JB]
Edited by JohnByrne2 on 28 September 2014 at 5:52am
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Brian J Nelson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 August 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 365
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| Posted: 27 September 2014 at 9:40pm | IP Logged | 2
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I'm not sure I understand what point it is you wish to discuss. If your point is whether this story could be discussed here, as a long time lurker before becoming a member, I don't believe I have seen anything of limits. As to what I think of the issue of your link, it is certainly tragic. I'm glad the CEO was a reserve deputy who had the training required by such a role.
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Koroush Ghazi
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 October 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 1648
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| Posted: 27 September 2014 at 11:14pm | IP Logged | 3
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Anthony Parente wrote:
| Luckily the CEO was a reserve deputy and had access to a firearm or this attack would have been way worse. |
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Similarly, luckily the perpetrator was using a knife instead of a gun, or this attack could have been way worse. Or the perp could have wrested the gun from the CEO, shot the CEO, and continued his attack now armed with a gun.
In any case, the gun was being wielded by someone connected to law enforcement. I can't speak for anyone else here, but I generally have no problem with guns in the hands of trained and accountable law enforcement or active duty military personnel.
If you're arguing that having ordinary citizens armed with guns would save more lives than they would endanger or wrongfully take, then I strongly disagree, and I don't think this particular incident proves anything of the sort.
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 12:17am | IP Logged | 4
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I won't dispute that it was lucky that the boss is also a cop with a gun. But likely far more people would have died if the attacker had used a firearm instead of knife.
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Matt Reed
Byrne Robotics Security
Robotmod
Joined: 16 April 2004
Posts: 35732
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 12:48am | IP Logged | 5
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Anthony Parente wrote:
| I was wondering if it was discussed here or just being ignored? |
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Why do you frame your question as an either/or? Are we required to discuss every gun related story and if we don't, can we actually be accused of "ignoring" those that aren't discussed? Seriously?
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Stephen Churay
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 March 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 8369
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 1:37am | IP Logged | 6
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I'm a lifetime member with the NRA, have over a dozen firearms and
have been a member here for over five years. When gun topics come
up, all I do is try to let everyone understand that there are
responsible, educated gun owners in the world. I'm not here to
change anyone's opinion. Many times I opt to stay out of the
discussion all together.
They are a tool with one designed purpose.
I personally had to draw on a human being once in my life when an
intruder attempted to break into my home at night. I was able to hold
the intruder at gunpoint until the police arrived at which time I
surrendered the firearm to them until the matter was completely
resolved. No shots were fired as it wasn't necessary, thank goodness.
Just the thought that if I had squeezed that trigger, he would be dead,
kept me sleepless for three nights. Still, if the threat of being held at
gunpoint wasn't enough to stop him, and I thought my family's lives
were in danger, I would have put him down.
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Neil Lindholm
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005
Location: China
Posts: 4940
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 2:41am | IP Logged | 7
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I read somewhere that the proper definition of the word "cult" should be any religion you join voluntarily as an adult. If you are born into a religion and you remain in it, you are simply being pragmatic. Your friends are there, your family is there. However, if you join any religion as an adult, be it Catholicism, Hare Krishna, Judaism, Scientology, Islam, etc., then you have joined a cult.
Never understood how a grown, thinking adult could ever voluntary join a religion (or cult) and have always been somewhat suspicious of their mental capabilities and powers of reason. Especially if someone becomes a muslim. Got to have some weird stuff going on in your head to join that group.
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James Long
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 23 September 2014
Location: Australia
Posts: 60
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 3:03am | IP Logged | 8
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I'm a lifetime member with the NRA, have over a dozen firearms and ...an intruder attempted to break into my home at night. ...Just the thought that if I had squeezed that trigger, he would be dead, kept me sleepless for three nights....They are a tool with one designed purpose... . I would have put him down.
____________________
In Chicago USA where any type of firearm is legal last year there were over a thousand firearm related deaths and this was apparently a pleasing reduction over previous years. In Melbourne Australia where firearm owners are required to keep their firearm and firing bolt in seperate locked boxes and no automatic or semi-atomatic weapons are allowed to be owned by non law enforcement professionals or active duty military there were 14 firearm related deaths and law enforcement are taking this very seriously because it was to them an alarming increase over previous years.
My grandfather owned one rifle that he used to shoot cockatoos out of fruit trees with, but only one. that he stored separately from the bolt to prevent his grandchildren from shooting each other with if he wasn't around or him with if he was.
I don't own a rifle because I live in town and there aren't any fruit trees that I can't live without nearby that are in danger. I also don't see any rational explanation for one person owning a dozen firearms.
Or any sense in broadcasting the fact. You say you had lain awake for 3 nights in fear that your weapon might have killed that person but what if you hadn't been home and the burglar had found your weapons stash? Wouldn't any use of the firearms, the burglar or the person he subsequently sold them on to, be entirely on you? Surely there is no doubt of your culpability if they broke in to steal the weapons because you told them that they were there.
Maybe you could sell 11 or 12 of your guns and get security windows, deadlocks and a burglar alarm with the money and no-one will need to be shot at all by you in your home because they won't be able to get in..
Edited by James Long on 28 September 2014 at 5:16am
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Carmen Bernardo
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 August 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 3666
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 3:54am | IP Logged | 9
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As you can see, Anthony, there are a wide range of views on the topic here that don't necessarily agree. It's one of those hot button issues that touches off the occasional firestorm. I'm more in the camp with Stephen, but without the NRA membership. Nor do I think that all NRA members are fanatics. Religious fanaticism, on the other hand...
I'm fine with a religious person, provided they learn to respect the privacy of those who won't convert to their faith. The man in question here was apparently a bad actor even after he converted, taking the missionary nature of Islam to an extreme and eventually getting himself fired from his job over the argument of whether to stone women or not (a very Old Testament way of thinking). I think that his own criminal tendencies and the extreme brand of Islam he had converted to were factors in his decision to go "solo-Jihad" on the co-workers.
This reminds me of the town drunk classmate of mine who turned Baptist missionary after having one too many. I don't think the mind was quite right there, too, but as far as I know he was never a habitual criminal with a violent streak.
Edited by Carmen Bernardo on 28 September 2014 at 3:55am
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James Long
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 23 September 2014
Location: Australia
Posts: 60
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 5:07am | IP Logged | 10
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INever understood how a grown, thinking adult could ever voluntary join a religion (or cult) and have always been somewhat suspicious of their mental capabilities and powers of reason.
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If it feels right don't think twice. |
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132282
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 5:56am | IP Logged | 11
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[Guns] are a tool with one designed purpose. •• To kill, with no regard to what they kill. What flavor Kool-Aid does the NRA prefer?
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Doug Centers
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 February 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 5467
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| Posted: 28 September 2014 at 6:20am | IP Logged | 12
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"In Chicago USA where any type of firearm is legal..."
...
Illinois state law prohibits the possession of automatic firearms and short barreled weapons.
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Topic Closed)
