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Marcio Ferreira
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 September 2008
Location: Brazil
Posts: 2518
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| Posted: 27 December 2014 at 7:05am | IP Logged | 1
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No one needs to believe in numbers of "opponents" of Cuba, no! According to official data, in 2006, for example, 67 903 women aged 12 to 49 have undergone at least one abortion - that is, of every 100 pregnant women, 37 aborted. Born a year about 3 million children. in Brazil. If the numbers were the same in Cuba, this would correspond to 63% of those not aborted (100 minus 37). Thus, the total would be 4,716,904 pregnant pregnant for 3 million births - ie: 1,716.8904 abortions. THAT'S MIRACLE CUBAN; KILL BEFORE BORN. These numbers end up with the monstrous farce that legalizing abortion causes a reduction in the number of occurrences.
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Kevin Hagerman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 April 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 17997
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| Posted: 27 December 2014 at 11:51am | IP Logged | 2
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Again, abortions are not a factor in calculating infant mortality rates.
And it's legalizing contraception, not abortion, that reduces abortions. Legalizing abortion reduces botched abortions, which is of course one of the reasons abortion should be legal.
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Joseph Gauthier
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Joined: 11 March 2009
Posts: 1415
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| Posted: 27 December 2014 at 5:49pm | IP Logged | 3
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Unilateral economic sanctions seem pointless
when Cuba sees trade and tourism dollars coming in from everyone
else, even close US allies like Canada and Europe.
Which is why I find the notion that US sanctions have hurt the Cuban people so puzzling, given that the Cuban state enjoys, to varying degrees both economic and diplomatic relations with seven of the G8 nations, plus relations with Russia and China. How exactly are the United States harming the Cuban people? What is it about a normalization of relations with the United States that would, in fact, help the Cuban people?
I often suspect that when politicians and other opinion leaders suggest that the United States are harming the Cuban people, what they really mean is that the United States are harming the Cuban people by not providing aid, which is, as always, a fallacious argument. But even were it not, it's an argument that discounts the inability to reach the people without first passing through the Cuban state.
I think allowing Cubans to interact with the exile American community
and allowing Cubans to come over here for schooling will do more to
effect change than whatever the embargo has been trying to do.
You're likely right about this, but the trouble with these suggestions is that they require a two-sided openness and we have no idea how much interaction the Cuban state will allow the Cuban people with the exile community, nor upon who's terms it would be conducted. We do know, however, that the Cuban state has no incentive to effect change, and that the Communist Party will remain in power; which means dissent will remain criminalized, and that foreign capital will continue to be confiscated.
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Jason Schulman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 2473
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| Posted: 27 December 2014 at 6:15pm | IP Logged | 4
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Joseph -- see: http://www.amnesty.org/en/library/info/AMR25/007/2009
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Jason Czeskleba
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 April 2004
Posts: 4549
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| Posted: 28 December 2014 at 3:08am | IP Logged | 5
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Marcio, I am curious about your "that is so outrageous" comment above. Are you disagreeing with Randy's assertion that the US has diplomatic relations with dictatorships as bad or worse than Cuba? Would you advocate the US breaking off diplomatic and trade relations with China and Saudi Arabia?
Edited by Jason Czeskleba on 28 December 2014 at 3:09am
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Brian Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 30921
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| Posted: 28 December 2014 at 7:48am | IP Logged | 6
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If the numbers were the same in Cuba, this would correspond to 63% of those not aborted (100 minus 37). Thus, the total would be 4,716,904 pregnant pregnant for 3 million births - ie: 1,716.8904 abortions. THAT'S MIRACLE CUBAN; KILL BEFORE BORN. These numbers end up with the monstrous farce that legalizing abortion causes a reduction in the number of occurrences.
*******************
These numbers are the "monstrous farce." You begin your whole argument with Cuba's numbers with the word "if." Falls apart right there.
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Kip Lewis
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 March 2011
Posts: 2880
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| Posted: 28 December 2014 at 8:12am | IP Logged | 7
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Wouldn't abortions of high-risk babies
help to reduce the infant mortality rate?
True that requires a proactive medical
care to determine that the child will not
likely survive long after birth and I
don't know if Cuba had that kind of
services offered to the masses.
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Jason Czeskleba
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 April 2004
Posts: 4549
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| Posted: 28 December 2014 at 1:23pm | IP Logged | 8
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I'm puzzled as to why the topic of abortion has been introduced into this discussion anyway. Is the premise that a country's abortion rate positively correlates with the degree of repression by its government? If so, that seems highly spurious.
Edited by Jason Czeskleba on 28 December 2014 at 1:23pm
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Kevin Hagerman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 April 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 17997
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| Posted: 28 December 2014 at 3:45pm | IP Logged | 9
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I think it's part of a general indictment of socialized medicine.
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Roy Johnson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 May 2013
Location: Canada
Posts: 1323
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| Posted: 28 December 2014 at 7:39pm | IP Logged | 10
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So, if Oswald had only waited another 51 years, his "Fair Play for Cuba" goal would have taken care of itself?
Sorry, been re-reading "CASE CLOSED". I'll show myself out.
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Marcio Ferreira
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 September 2008
Location: Brazil
Posts: 2518
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| Posted: 30 December 2014 at 8:15am | IP Logged | 11
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Brian Miller, what I meant is that IF the numbers in Brazil had the same abortion rates, hence the total number of abortions would be that high.
I am amused by the fact that people in USA are unable to recognize the obvious PROPAGANDA made by the Cuban Communist party. Numbers, rates and statistics are manipulated.
For example, see the rates of mothers that died because of pregnancy complications, in Cuba the rates are at least 3 times higher than the ones in USA.
Maybe Cuban people who risk their lives trying to get to Florida are just ungrateful ....
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Jason Schulman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 2473
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| Posted: 30 December 2014 at 3:58pm | IP Logged | 12
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Numbers, rates and statistics are manipulated by the CIA World Factbook? (Does the CIA lie to itself?) The World Health Organization?
http://www.who.int/bulletin/volumes/86/5/08-030508/en/
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Topic Closed)
