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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132335
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| Posted: 28 July 2015 at 4:56am | IP Logged | 1
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I'm surprised that Obama is so unpopular considering that his administration ...(1) extended the ability to obtain medical covered to, what, 50-60 million Americans (I was stunned that this many Americans were doing without coverage, after all, the US is a "rich" country) (2) didn't start any wars with a foreign power (3) is pushing the US to become energy-independent by, what, 2025? (4) is actually leading and negotiating a nuclear development agreement with Iran (5) resume diplomatic relationships with Cuba (6) is succesfully leading anti-lebensraum econimc sanctions on Russia •• Ignoring the idea of the second point being an "accomplishment," how many of the others are unique to Obama? How many would have not happened/happened without him in office? To my eye, they all read as more to do with the march of history than the man in the White House.
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Craig Markley
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3969
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| Posted: 28 July 2015 at 5:31am | IP Logged | 2
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Bill said, "The medical coverage is nothing to brag about. My rates have tripled since it's become "affordable" (while getting nothing new in return), even though I have no pre-existing health problems. I'm on the verge of dropping my coverage altogether since it's gotten so expensive. "
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Usually those whose insurance rates have double/tripled are due to their governor not expanding Medicaid. Where do you live Bill?
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Michael Penn
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 April 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 12448
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| Posted: 28 July 2015 at 6:28am | IP Logged | 3
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So very much of what a president can count as her own accomplishments has to do with how successfully she can push her vision through the Legislature. I think in that regard Obama deserves credit (if not plaudits?) for keeping a great many of his health care promises.
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Kevin Brown
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 May 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 8846
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| Posted: 28 July 2015 at 8:36am | IP Logged | 4
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JB wrote:
| Ignoring the idea of the second point being an "accomplishment," how many of the others are unique to Obama? How many would have not happened/happened without him in office? To my eye, they all read as more to do with the march of history than the man in the White House. |
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Considering that the other choice in 2012 was Mitt Romney, NONE of those would have occurred had Romney won. In fact, I strongly suspect that many things Obama did between 2008-2012 would have been either reversed or severely cut.
While I personally think he should have pushed back a lot harder on some things, he did accomplish a lot considering the opposition on nearly everything. 50 years from now I think his Presidency will be looked upon as highly favorable; the Congress he had to deal with less so.
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David Allen Perrin
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 April 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 3549
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| Posted: 28 July 2015 at 9:05am | IP Logged | 5
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Here, here Kevin!
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132335
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| Posted: 28 July 2015 at 10:26am | IP Logged | 6
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Compare Obama to LBJ. Look at the accomplishments of that truly great President, virtually expunged from people's minds because of the war in Vietnam. As I said, I voted for Obama twice, but I seriously doubt history will do much to polish his image.
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James Reese
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 18 July 2015
Location: United States
Posts: 434
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| Posted: 28 July 2015 at 11:47am | IP Logged | 7
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Look at the accomplishments of that truly great President, virtually expunged from people's minds because of the war in Vietnam.
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The Vietnam War is a pretty big reason that LBJ isn't a truly great President. A lot of men were drafted under his administration and a lot of them were killed; over 30,000.
Despite signing the Civil Rights Act of 1964, he was also a racist. The paragraph in the article below about the chauffer is especially cringe-worthy.
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/lyndon-johnson-civil-rights-racis m
Kennedy was the mastermind of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and he would have signed it had he lived.
http://www.ourdocuments.gov/doc.php?flash=true&doc=97
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
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| Posted: 28 July 2015 at 11:54am | IP Logged | 8
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Kennedy was the mastermind of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and he would have signed it had he lived.••• And Kennedy began our involvement in Vietnam. Let's not forget that while we're preparing the tar and feathers for Johnson. LBJ was a vulgarian (and a TEXAN!!) but he rose above his beginnings to do what was right for the Nation. He was trapped in a war not of his making. What he accomplished despite this is what makes him a great President. And let us also not forget that Nixon could have ended our involvement in Vietnam his first day in office, but he wanted to be the President who WON that war.
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Kevin Brown
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 May 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 8846
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| Posted: 28 July 2015 at 12:27pm | IP Logged | 9
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JB wrote:
| Compare Obama to LBJ. Look at the accomplishments of that truly great President, virtually expunged from people's minds because of the war in Vietnam. |
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Only to those who are not students of history, which, unfortunately, is the majority of people.
My memory and knowledge of LBJ is about civil rights, education, and the space program.
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James Reese
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| Posted: 28 July 2015 at 12:46pm | IP Logged | 10
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And Kennedy began our involvement in Vietnam.
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The troop level when Kennedy was killed in Vietnam was 16,000, with 122 KIA. The troop level when LBJ left office was 500,000, with 30,000 KIA. 28,000 troops were KIA when Nixon was in office.
Nobody knows what Kennedy would have done in Vietnam had he not be killed. According to the jfk library website. "In the final weeks of his life, President Kennedy wrestled with the future of the United States' commitment in Vietnam. Whether he would have increased military involvement or negotiated a withdrawal of military personnel still remains hotly debated among historians and officials who served in the administrations of President Kennedy and President Lyndon B. Johnson."
http://www.jfklibrary.org/JFK/JFK-in-History/Vietnam.aspx
Regarding Vietnam, Johnson and Nixon are a much better comparison than Johnson and Kennedy.
Edited by James Reese on 28 July 2015 at 12:48pm
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Stephen Robinson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5835
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| Posted: 28 July 2015 at 8:13pm | IP Logged | 11
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If we consider marriage equality to be on par with the Civil Rights Act (for
good or for ill -- I'd rather we not debate that issue at present), then
Obama would deserve some credit for appointing the two justices who
helped make it possible (Kagan and Sotomayer). A President McCain's
Supreme Court selections would most likely have resulted in a 6 - 3
ruling against.
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Steven Myers
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 10 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5626
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| Posted: 07 August 2015 at 5:34pm | IP Logged | 12
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After witnessing the Republicans debate, I have decided there are 4 reasonable people that look a bit electable: Bush, Rubio, Christie, and Kasich.
Trump and Carson look incompetent.
The rest are just plain scary with their ideas!!
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