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Topic: Why were all the superheroes created in such a narrow window? Post ReplyPost New Topic
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Rebecca Jansen
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Posted: 17 March 2018 at 1:34pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Something as brilliant as Pan's Labyrinth and Shape Of Water really gets me excited about what's possible, so glad they were recognized and successful commercially to. Lilo & Stitch was another that got me jazzed on what could be too but this is about super characters I guess.

Okay, so the 'superhero' came into being in the '30s as a visual concept that sort of one-upped earlier adventure characters like Tarzan and Doc Savage and The Shadow right? Then in WWII they went from punching out crooks like we wish would happen to punching out Hitler (Kirby again was first) and Tojo like people then wished would happen. Then after the war they began evaporating, sexy girl characters were added to many to keep the interest of ex-G.I.s, Atlas did a reboot on their big three (Cap, Subby and Torch) well before the new Infantino Flash, but really, superhero weren't ruling the roost anymore, they had become stale, had less purpose, dated etc. Stan Lee writes a lot of daffy monster comics and wishes they could get decent distribution.

Pop-Art, lack of anything else setting things on fire, but superheroes gradually come back at DC (new Flash, new Green Lantern, The Justice League), at Archie (The Fly by Kirby, The Shield, The Jaguar), and finally Marvel jumps back in with a lighter somewhat tongue-in-cheek approach that fits with the times and the Pop-Art happening for awhile as well.

People have carried on from there, but maybe the big question after the '60s is why superheroes? Why even super powers? If you can answer that for yourself maybe you'll be halfway to something. I actually disliked superhero comics (other than Shazam and Supergirl) until around age 11 when one Jetsons and then the Star Wars comics got me in the door of looking at something with Marvel on it. Later I got annoyed at how all the eggs always seemed to go into the super basket even though I still found things to enjoy such as Power Pack and Fantastic Four. I heard stories about people obsessed with super characters, every one that ever existed, having it's own comic again, and if Godzilla or a war or mystery comic sold they'd still get rid of it as somehow not in-keeping with their line image.

Always with the superheroes again, what's with that? Then they started going further than a single edgy character like Wolverine or The Punisher, espeically at DC they seemed to grow muscles and killing and dying and having multiple covers and starting at #1 again and... I was gone (at least as a reader/buyer) by the worst of it.

You can always do other things right? Right? Maybe most people get worn out on the super powers and costumes concepts. Marvel did monsters for years (dovetailing into The Hulk, The Thing and Ant-Man by the way). Doctor Strange used to be different, and Nick Fury, but they tied them down with the super universe possibly making them unfit for the non-committed 'universe' reader. It used to be you could buy a single Hulk or Spider-Man and know where you were if you'd not bought the last bunch. Plus being mostly found in specialist shops hindered accessibility further (never minding if they were uninviting shops sometimes too).

Why did people dump on Devil Dinosaur? Why was Fred Hembeck embarrassed to have a woman see him buying a Godzilla comic (but not some dude in tights?) at a general public type store?


Edited by Rebecca Jansen on 17 March 2018 at 1:44pm
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Robbie Parry
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Posted: 17 March 2018 at 1:40pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

 Rebecca Jansen wrote:
People have carried on from there, but maybe the big question after the '60s is why superheroes?

Good point.

Britain had a very diverse group of comics for a while. Superheroes were the exception rather than the rule. 

I bought the EAGLE in the 80s. It was an anthology title. Within a typical issue (let's go back to, say, '86), there was a war/special forces strip, a football strip, a strip about an alien, a strip about youths out to make money, a strip about a police dog, a strip about a sentient tower block computer, etc. 

Not a superhero in sight at times! 
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Rebecca Jansen
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Posted: 17 March 2018 at 1:47pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Actually I can answer my question Robbie. It should be "why superheroes? Because I like them. They're fun. I enjoy the fantasy." Nothing wrong with them inherently. Maybe if the answer is to make a lot of money, to see my name on character Z, or I can't think of or draw anything else, those could be the wrong answers.
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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 17 March 2018 at 1:53pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Hmmm...I say the opposite with so many ways and avenues to go viral, it should be easier today to become universal.

——-

How does more competition for your attention make it easier? When I was a kid, there were 10 channels and people were gravitating to the same thing because they had few alternatives. Now there are 500 channels, and my niece and nephew couldn’t give a shit because they are busy watching someone play Minecraft on YouTube. 
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Robbie Parry
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Posted: 17 March 2018 at 3:08pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

 Michael Roberts wrote:
When I was a kid, there were 10 channels and people were gravitating to the same thing because they had few alternatives.

Ten channels?!!!

Here in the UK, we had three (BBC One, BBC Two and ITV). In 1982, we got Channel 4. And in 1997, we got Channel 5. Those were terrestrial channels, of course there were more if you had satellite.

10 channels? I'd have been ecstatic. ;-)
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Rebecca Jansen
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Posted: 17 March 2018 at 4:25pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

Yes, I've heard people mention what a huge thing it was when Channel 4  started up. I'm glad it did too because I really liked Brookside and some other shows made for it. :^)

Vampires and horror is another thing that has waxed and waned in popularity like superheroes. Something has to go away for awhile to then make a comeback and get rediscovered.
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Peter Martin
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Posted: 17 March 2018 at 7:06pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Highest viewing figures ever for Dr Who in the UK? In 1979 with City of Death. Why? Because there was a strike that affected ITV. You had a choice between Dr Who on BBC1 or a repeat of the snooker on BBC2. A third of the country chose Tom Baker and Lalla Ward (well, OK, I don't really know if it was the snooker or not, but let's face it, there's a good chance).

I remember at school on the following Monday, everyone could discuss what they had watched at the weekend and we'd have all caught the same thing.

Fast forward 40 years and the dispersion of channels means the likelihood of everyone watching the same thing at once at the same time is significantly slimmer.

There are still breakout stars though.

Whether you want to have heard of the Kardashians or not, you will have heard of the Kardashians. With little talent spread between seven of them, this is quite the achievement.

To echo slightly what Michael said upthread, I remember my Dad at the Sunday dinner table in the mid-eighties banging on about how the music of my era was crud because no-one had any longevity. He asked me to name someone who was popular who'd been around a while and my cotton-wool child's brain dredged up Billy Ocean. Of course, the correct answer was: nearly every last mother who was big in the 60s and 70s and still alive, because the rotters never went way.

Even my mum knows who Adele is. My Dad does not, but then again, he can probably only name you Elvis from the 50s, which is the era he grew up in.

People like Rihanna, Taylor Swift, Miley Cyrus and Katy Perry are inescapably famous and they are of the now. To deny otherwise, is to be simply an old curmudgeon.


Edited by Peter Martin on 17 March 2018 at 7:07pm
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Rebecca Jansen
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Posted: 17 March 2018 at 7:24pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Teen-Age Mutant Ninja Turtles was a huge everyone heard about it thing that came from comic books, it was a sort of mash-up of genres. It could happen again tomorrow.
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Peter Hicks
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Posted: 17 March 2018 at 7:31pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

In the 80s, I too noticed how how few good new characters were showing up in DC and Marvel comics, and concluded creators were saving their good ideas for small publishers where they would own the rights.  But I felt that X-Men kept on giving us new characters regardless (Rogue, Gambit, Bishop) and that helped them stand out from the pack.

JB - When you took over Superman, was there any expectation of new characters that you would create?
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Peter Martin
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Posted: 17 March 2018 at 9:45pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

Rogue is an interesting call as far as comics characters go. A lot is made of Wolverine and Punisher being the only significant Marvel properties invented after the 60s goldrush, and yet there is Rogue, a child of the 80s... and I would say a pretty big character for Marvel. And another one from the 80s -- a certain Katherine Pryde!

Gambit and Bishop brushed with the tail-end of my comics collecting. I bought and read comics with them in, but my mind is ill-adjusted to them. In some ways, they still seem like new characters to my fossilised grey matter. I gather they were popular, but I'm kind of a civilian when it comes to comics post-1995.


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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 18 March 2018 at 1:41am | IP Logged | 11 post reply

Ten channels?!!!  

Here in the UK, we had three (BBC One, BBC Two and ITV). In 1982, we got Channel 4. And in 1997, we got Channel 5. Those were terrestrial channels, of course there were more if you had satellite. 

10 channels? I'd have been ecstatic. ;-)

——

I had the local ABC, CBS, NBC, and later, Fox affiliates. PBS. Two independent stations on UHF (which much later on became the UPN and WB affiliates) and three LA stations that the antenna was able to pick up.

Then in the 90s, my family got cable, and we had one of those slider boxes then went up to 43 channels.



Edited by Michael Roberts on 18 March 2018 at 1:43am
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Robbie Parry
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Posted: 18 March 2018 at 8:19am | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Well, we'll see how Sideways and Damage do (their books, published by DC, were released recently, although they are derivative).

Mind you, isn't almost everything derivative? Pulp heroes inspired Batman, Swamp Thing and Man-Thing have a "common ancestor", etc, etc.
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