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Wayne Osborne
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 7:27pm | IP Logged | 1  

"You may get the owners of the site to change it for you but that
would be out of politeness, not legality.
"

Seriously? You think information written on a site that operates
under the guise of an "encyclopedia" shouldn't consist of facts rather
than opinion. God, I can hardly wait for the day when someone sets
the legal precedents that apply the libel and slander laws to the 'net.

WO
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Wayne Osborne
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 7:33pm | IP Logged | 2  

Gamaliel Snapdragon? I didn't know they had internet access in
Rivendell............I bet the trolls there are a real bitch.

WO
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John W Leys
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 7:37pm | IP Logged | 3  

Do you go to the top when you haven't done anything else?  If you buy a defective product, do you try returning it to the store first, or do you immediately write to the president of Best Buy?

No, but if a newspaper/magazine or other publication were to publish false or possible libelous information about me I would go directly to the Editor in Chief and/or the Publisher and get it corrected.
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Dave Pruitt
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 7:47pm | IP Logged | 4  

Is Wikipedia a vast organization, where Mr. Jimbo Wales is way, way at the top of some corporate food chain?
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Guest79877180
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 7:49pm | IP Logged | 5  

Well said John.
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Gamaliel Snapdragon
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 8:41pm | IP Logged | 6  


 QUOTE:
No, but if a newspaper/magazine or other publication were to publish false or possible libelous information about me I would go directly to the Editor in Chief and/or the Publisher and get it corrected.


I can't imagine any sincere Wikipedia editor objecting to the removal of "false or possible libelous information".  What was removed included pictures, links, and a bibliography, not to mention about 95% of the article.  Surely the pictures and bibliography were not libelous.

This could all be solved if someone would just point out exactly what the "false or possible libelous information" actually is.  The top dog has been contacted and he doesn't even know.  According to Jimbo


 QUOTE:
John Byrne has complained that this article contains a lot of falsehoods, rumors, innuendo, etc. He has not yet given me specific details of what that means.
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Joe Zhang
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 8:58pm | IP Logged | 7  

Gamaliel, you have encouraged the inclusion of material that is possibly libelous. From the archived discussions about the JB article:

Given the ridiculous number of Byrne v. Byrne disputes over all these events, setting them out at the current level of detail, whether here or elsewhere, is entirely inappropriate.

N. Caligon 16:43, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

I don't see how just because something is a bit muddled and confusing is grounds for avoiding the issue altogether. Gamaliel 16:51, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)
We can address everything in this paragraph: "Byrne is one of the most successful artist / writers of his generation. He is also one of the most outspoken and independent-minded freelancers, freely leaving one assignment or publisher for another if disuptes could not be resolved." Simple as that. -Rod
Sorry, that's a nice intro sentence but hardly suffices. Gamaliel 17:06, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)
We can work from there, but there shouldn't be more than a paragraph. Any more and it will drown out any substantive discussion of his work. -Rod
I oppose the setting of arbitrary limits on how much space should be devoted to particular material. Gamaliel 17:10, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

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Paul Greer
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 9:02pm | IP Logged | 8  

I would have to say listing names of people who JB is "feuding" with is not a matter of fact but an opinion. Trying to imply he ignores certain creators visions of characters and quits books so he doesn't have to work with creators is something people might assume, but is not a fact. A fact would be he worked on a title for x amount of issues. Why the book or JB didn't last longer on those books is information between JB and an editor, everything else is just a third party source which may not be reliable.  Just as if you were using Marvel and DC art if any of the artwork was used from JB's creator owned titles wouldn't you need permission from the owner of that work to reproduce his art?

These are just a few observations that I found to be wrong with the article. But it is about JB's life and career he would be far better to elaborate on what is misrepresented in his life than a group of fans.

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Joe Zhang
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 9:04pm | IP Logged | 9  

This is what Jimbo has directed participants to do:

John Byrne has complained that this article contains a lot of falsehoods, rumors, innuendo, etc. He has not yet given me specific details of what that means. But I read through the article and while it was pretty good, it was filled with a lot of 'weasel words' like "Some say..."

I'd like to see facts added back into the article (the facts from the parts I have removed for now) with exquisite attention to sourcing every little thing. If we don't have a source for it, don't say it. No speculation, no opinion, no editorializing. Shining clean pure neutrality with a hard hard look at sources.

--Jimbo Wales 01:07, 15 September 2005 (UTC)


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John W Leys
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 9:11pm | IP Logged | 10  

If we don't have a source for it, don't say it.

What a novel idea for an encyclopedia article...
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Joe Zhang
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 9:13pm | IP Logged | 11  

They are going to quote articles from two or three decades ago by memory. I say we should insist on them scanning the relevant parts of the article and uploading it. 
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Francis Grey
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Joined: 07 August 2005
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Posted: 14 September 2005 at 9:49pm | IP Logged | 12  

Encyclopedia.  Right.

 

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